#247 AI's Revolutionary Role in Farming and Philanthropy: A Talk with Mike De'Shazer

0:00:02 - Mehmet
Hello and welcome back to a new episode of the CTO  Show with Mehmet. Today, I'm very pleased to have with me someone from the same city where I am based in Dubai. Mike, thank you very much for joining me on the podcast today, and the way I love to do it is I keep it to my guests to introduce themselves, because I believe it's the best way someone introduces himself or herself. So the floor is yours. 

0:00:27 - Mike
Well, first of all, thank you for the introduction. My name is Mike De'Shazer and I am the lead dev and the executive director at Giving Desk, and we are an AI based company that sits at the intersection of farms, ai and industry. 

0:00:44 - Mehmet
Great, great. So first question what brought you to Dubai, mike? 

0:00:51 - Mike
So what brought me to Dubai? Well, I'll tell you this. It wasn't summer and the over 40 to 50 degrees Celsius, but about everything else brought me to Dubai. 

0:01:09 - Mehmet
That's a good one to have. So it's like I always tell people it's buzzing, you know, with startups and technology and you see a lot of entrepreneurs around. So you know, like Mike, when I was preparing, you're doing something really. You know, I would say different with what anyone else is doing with AI, so interested to know. You know, how did you get into this combination between AI and actually farming and food security? Can you tell me a little bit more about that? 

0:01:43 - Mike
Well, from a business perspective, if you think about it, food is never going out of style. So, you know, it kind of just made sense. And with regards to artificial intelligence, I've just been involved in the space for a very, very long time, and so the two, the two interests, had a baby, and that is giving desk. We were founded actually to make a difference in the world. We, you know, there as much as in the Western world or the developed world, we can throw away food and you know, and just kind of take for granted things that sustain us and a lot of the world, that's still a huge problem. 

You know, there are a lot of people who die from hunger on a day. Millions of people a year die of hunger, and not only that, in so many countries, especially in the developing world or the global south, and even in places, you know, in the global north that aren't as developed, you have situations where developing countries are dependent on imports of their food, and so it's it's a complex issue, but it's something that it really comes down to intelligent planning and there is a way that we all developing nations, developed nations, frontier markets even can benefit from smarter ecosystems, and that's what AI really has the power to do is just kind of create prosperity across the board. At least that's how we see it. So we don't see it as a zero sum game. I know some people do. That's why we're called giving desk. We believe that the more we all can give one another mutually, the greater the whole, the bigger the pie becomes for all of us. And so that's that's kind of the long side of that explanation. 

0:03:41 - Mehmet
Yeah, that's really an interesting use case, which is, you know, I can see it also has, you know, the phenotropic approach also as well. So, how, you know you, you merge, you know this with AI driven business model, because I know, you know, like, basically it's like the first time you know I'm very curious to understand, like how, how actually you leverage the AI to fulfill the greater use case and cause that you are trying to achieve. 

0:04:21 - Mike
So I would like to start. So there are two points that you mentioned. One was philanthropy, which we are not about, and not because we don't believe that philanthropy can be good, it just has a really bad history of not working out so well. So we really believe in teaching people how to fish instead of giving them fish. You know, it's kind of like the whole Bill Gates fish net thing where he's like or the mosquito nets, he's like oh, let's stop malaria with these, with these, you know, mosquito nets, and then people use them to fish and then poison the water and then end up killing them People. So yeah, it's. You know, we really believe in empowering, and the giving side of what we do is about inspiring a spirit of giving. So when we look at opportunities so everyone on our team we start our training like this you know, there are people who walk into a room. They say to themselves OK, how can I, what can I take from this person to get what I want? And there are people who say how can I give value to this person so that we mutually benefit? And so that's the giving side and that's what we believe in on the give side. 

And then to go back to the other part that you were mentioning about how AI is playing a role in that, and that's that's really around Finding more efficient ways and allowing all of us to see the same thing better. 

So we have a thing called flags. You go to giveflagcom, you upload any document like a credit card contract or an insurance policy or a business plan. It goes through the whole thing, finds all the inconsistencies. Those are red flags, yellow flags things that you might need to reconsider and then green flags opportunities that are within that document. Because before we got these big stacks of paper and these conventions, these treaties, these laws, these plans, these financial statements, everyone, especially the lawyers and the accountants could complicate it. All the politicians and everyone and everyone makes up their own perception on it. We wanted to cut that out so that when people are looking at their economic structure or their business structure or their legal structure, they're able to all see the same thing, understand the inconsistencies very clearly, so that we can create a more prosperous mutual growth and also just well-being for whatever initiative that we're focused on at any given time. 

0:07:00 - Mehmet
Great. Now this opens for me the need to ask you the next question, because you mentioned some of the jobs that are existing today. So, based on what you and the team you are doing today, mike, so how do you see the future of work when AI is in the picture? We know, maybe if we did this interview or this episode one years ago, we're going to have mentioned something else, but today, with all this rapid evolution, so how are you seeing the landscape of jobs in general, and especially in the areas that you just touched, based on Well, I'm curious to get your thoughts on that. 

0:07:53 - Mike
I'm not trying to turn the tables around or anything, but I'm curious. Where do you see it going? 

0:08:02 - Mehmet
Again this question. I asked it many times and people keep asking me why you keep asking the same question on the pot. Because I said I want to hear different opinions, because every time I ask the question I gain more insights. Now back to the question that was flipped on me. Just joking. 

There is a short midterm kind of changes that would happen and there is something I see in long term. In the short midterm, of course, people would resist at the beginning and there will be a lot of people saying no, we don't want to use this, stop that. But within I would say less than two years times, some jobs will disappear. This is a matter of fact and people would need to upskill themselves so they can use the AR, so they can keep up with it. This is my opinion and this is something that happened every time a major technology came and some jobs they became irrelevant. Now the long one, which I think I'm not sure how long, maybe it's like 10 years, 20 years, maybe less. I cannot predict that. 

I believe the term job itself will have different meaning. You would not be doing something for living, because I think humans will reach a place. It's not like they don't have to wall, but I mean, it becomes something you do it on a social level and your income is taking care of somehow, so you don't need to do a job to get money. This is my opinion, because the technology, I see it going this way and I see every guest also I spoke with they give this insight. They are not saying this will happen, but this let me think that we're going to reach some stage where you know, we don't have really to call it job, we don't have to call it career. It's changing. It's a little bit philosophical, I know, but this is my own view. Mike, I hope to hear you. 

0:10:23 - Mike
Well, so wait, what's your answer? I'm a little bit. It's like OK, so you're saying that we're going to lose some jobs. This is just a natural progression, you know, like when cars came out or when the telephone came out or when the computer came out. Ok, I get that, but it's still very broad. It's a broad, broad. I guess that's the job, right when you're the host, it's the to do that. 

I would say two things. One, elon Musk I believe it was Elon Musk. He said you know well, the difference with AI versus all other technology and how we judge it, is that it's not a technology, it's a species. So, like I halfway agree with that. So I think there's a conversation there that's a whole big other can of worms. Let's stay away from that for a little while. But I would say you know, I look to prison specifically. 

I've never been to prison and I hope never to go. But if you look at prison economics, I think there's a lot we can learn about what the future is going to look like with AI as far as our economic structure. So in prison, everyone, wow, you know, I feel like people are going to walk away from this podcast and going to be like the prison story. That's going to be the thing, but the I think the key is that you look at prison. You have what you have people who are given housing, they're given food, they can work if they want to. They don't have to. Yet you have whole economies inside of these places, right, you've got, you've got whole companies they call them gangs, I guess, inside of these things, like you were saying. 

As far as the social component, I would love to see a study that merged these two concepts and maybe, because I think you know, if you read Adam Smith, wealth of Nations, the thing that we've, you know the Bible of modern capitalism and you bring it up. You know I might have a copy somewhere, but it talks about right, to do a quick economics thing the scarcity of things. Right? 

The labor required and how pricing is determined, and demand, and when you strip out a lot of the human element, when it goes way past automation to you know, strategy, development, decision making at the highest levels that you know we'll always need humans for a bit of the nuance, and lawyers will always stay relevant. They'll always find a way to do that. But I think we're going to a place where uncharted water. So it's a little bit of what Elon Musk is saying with new species, a little bit of let's look at prison economics, and then a little bit of let's revisit Adam Smith and what he's talking about with regards to how we live in our current capitalist system and how pricing is determined, because a lot of those things are about to change, and so I think there's a lot. I would say use gift flag. Gift flag will give you the answer. When, when? Ai personas, when? 

0:14:25 - Mehmet
excuse me, no, no, just I was saying, like you know, what mentioned is 100%. You know some people, okay, so you mentioned Elon Musk, right? So I had Sid Muhassib, who's you know he calls himself the philosophical entrepreneur, and I had also a couple of other guests and we discussed, like, the point here that we still we don't know, is the AI, whether we consider it as a technology only or, as Elon Musk called it, a species. It's in the hands now of big tech companies, right, and they are the ones who are controlling this technology and how we consume this technology. Now, until we have alternatives where we can have multiple options of using these AI tools this is why I told you like, in the short and mid term, we will not see this, because there is another fight and you brought the point about capitalism also as well and these big tech are the results of the capitalism, right? So until people find a way that they are not dependent on big tech to leverage the AI, we can, as you mentioned, say uncharted water Like this is my, again, addition to what you just mentioned, mike. 

This is what I wanted to say. 

0:15:57 - Mike
Yes, uncharted. Yes, we're most certainly in Uncharted water, but it's exciting, it's really exciting, and I would say that I think Meta AI has now been announced. We've got Bard, you've got Open AI and you've got a few other companies. You've got Open Source LLMs, and so I wouldn't say that it's just in the hands of big companies. I mean, we're leveraging it. We're running mountains of data, huge files, laws. 

We were running the latest US bill 800 pages, right through the platform to understand what was actually happening in that bill. This has been something that no one is really. I mean, people could sit and you could read it, but getting the inconsistencies, you need a whole team of analysts. So it's democratizing access to information. I found out the other day that the Wall Street Journal sets the interest rate on your American Express Platinum card. Right, it's right there in the terms and conditions. Right, it could go from 21% to 29% based on a publication by the Wall Street Journal, right, and so those pieces being able to come out. You won't find a lot of that information just on the internet. There are so many things we don't know, and now we're able to understand our policies and our laws in whole new ways. 

That was just in Rwanda. We bought us a bit of farmland and we get 45 years that we can hold that land until it's decided by the state whether it gets repatriated, based on whether infrastructure has been developed on it. Why is that? How did the land rights really work? So we were loading up academic papers, we were loading up laws. The partners that we have there, who own a lot of the property around where we have just purchased a bit of land, they're using our platform. Now they're like, hey, we're trying to figure out how to put the IoT devices and everything around it to make it work. But they're like, hey, we're not lawyers, now we can understand the laws around our property, and that's so empowering, that's so wonderful. So I would say, yes, it's in the hands of the big companies, but man, it's so empowering for the little guys and that's the magic. These guys didn't have teams, hundreds of analysts at Goldman Sachs or Boston Consulting Group and all these things, and it's the big companies that are actually falling behind. Because of all kinds of compliance reasons, because of all kinds of data privacy. They're not even able to use these technologies yet. And it's the little guys who are like, hey, we got to just make something work, and so they're adopting it first. So we're having a bit of a I think a Kodak moment, a Xerox moment if you will across the enterprise, where you have these crazy upstarts like us, who it can come in. 

And we're looking at the mergers and acquisitions space. We're looking at the venture capital space. We're saying these deals take six to nine months. That's ridiculous. This lawyer passes this to this accountant. This accountant passes it over to this financial advisor. This financial advisor passes over to this business consultant. 

They all took $100,000 an hour or some other crazy fees. They passed it all back around between each other, found one little issue, sent it back around the companies that were involved in the merger or the investment. They've got other stuff going on. These guys create more confusion in the deal, get more billable hours up their fees through all these weird contracts that no one understand they signed because middle-sized companies don't have teams of analysts and more than two or three people in their M&A division, which is just like the CEO and a 23-year-old, and so we just got an MBA who's kind of working on the deal, like at a plastics company in Iowa, and so this is huge. 

It can be hugely disruptive to a lot of the bigger companies that have really just been. You know what was it? I think the number that in the M&A space, the numbers that these guys, these Boston Consulting Group, these Goldman Sachs guys, these big law firms like the DLA Pipers and all these guys are charging, comes out into the trillions of dollars. Trillions of dollars and that's doing middleman activities and that can be washed away and we can focus those talents that those really smart people have on building things instead of focusing on just transactions. We can be creating content, better content, we can be creating more efficient highways, we can be exploring the cosmos. You know, like Elon Musk also says, you know we need less MBAs, and I say that as an. 

MBA, but we need less MBAs. We need more engineers. We need more creators, content creators. We need more people who are focused on value, on food, on farming, things like that 100%, mike, and thank you for bringing this. 

0:21:29 - Mehmet
And you know, because you mentioned, you know about fundraising, venture capitalist and M&A merger acquisitions. So, and to your point, what I tried to do a couple of months I think two months back. So I did an experiment where, instead of you know, a founder struggle in front of an angel investor or a VC or maybe a banker. So I wanted to explore if AI can help here. And actually it's not like I created from scratch, but I used some tools that allowed me to have a simple app where it asks you some questions. 

You get, for example, what's your ideas about, what's the business model you are planning to apply, which problem you are solving, you know your target audience and so on, and then feed this to the AI and then let the AI give you some you know feedback, first about the idea in general, and then give you some advice on how, for example, to make it more compelling when you speak, for example, to an investor. 

Right, and I let some people use it, like four or five people used it and they were mind blown. You know like, wow, like we want this badly. So I didn't have time, of course, to complete something in my backlogs also as well. But to your point, and here I'm curious to know how because you mentioned, like small startups are leveraging the AI, so how this is changing the whole startup ecosystem and how you know it's going to be changing and it's actually started to change. You know all these activities behind the startup ecosystem, like whether it's, you know, raising funds, maybe going to market, you know planning to expand, so how AI will be able to change the whole outside ecosystem. 

0:23:30 - Mike
Well, I'll tell you one way. I can speak to my personal experience. So you know we have a give flag and you know we have nine personas. So you have a CTO, a CMO, a CSO, a compliance officer all that baked in. So you log in for free and you're chatting with the whole team. So they're checking each other on validity and all these other things. They're all separate. They all have their personality. You can click on them and you can see. You know where they went to school. You know they have like whole. You know they have certain personality profiles. Some of them are more cautious, some of them are more ambitious, some of them are more of a risk taker, some of them are a little more talkative, some of them are a little more reckless, some of them are, you know, conservative, and so they all have their own ways and so. But as a team they're very well rounded and so you can get different perspectives as you step through plans, upload files, surf the internet. 

Me personally, I don't use Google anymore, I just use give flag. I was out, I took. I have two boys. I went out with them. I was actually held over in Rwanda a few more extra days than I was supposed to because of a little flight glitch, so I had to make it up to the family when I got back. So I took them out to Abu Dhabi and I want to take them to the Yassmarina or whatever. And my kids weren't old enough, some of them, to do some of the go-karting and so I used. I couldn't find the answer on the internet, so I just used give flag. I was talking to the team, they were searching all over the internet. They gave me all the information and 10 minutes later our kids were in, you know, riding around go-karts, and that problem was solved like that. Another problem that I solved was around how we're gonna bring water electricity to one of the new plots that we just purchased. Another problem that I solved. Actually, ai is the reason that we're talking right now. To be honest, you'll get back to that later, but but that's what we else that came through gift-flat, right, understanding those things. So one thing is the search engines of today. 

You know, when you mix Google with open AI through a platform like give flag, where you have the different personalities and the different strategic approaches, really magical things can happen. Just like when you're in a team, right, you sit in a team with people who share a goal but all have different backgrounds. That diversity of thought and I think that's really we're the next part we go to, because a lot of us stay in our little silos a lot, right, you know, we read certain newspapers, read certain magazines. We, we will, you know, online, you know we, or or in print, we, we consume certain types of. You know, youtube's gotten really good. It's just kind of giving you exactly what you already believe and just enforcing that constantly, right, and so we have these bubbles and I think the where we're going that's interesting is that we're gonna be able to broaden out. Actually, a lot of people think we're gonna close more in, but I I've seen the diversity of thought and how Powerful that is for people to reach their personal goals. I think for startups, we're gonna see a trend towards diversity of thought when we look at different Problems. 

So when we look at what's happening in Israel right now, with with Palestine right, there's so many there it goes so deep. There's such a rich history and if you just go on the news and you just look at what's happening, you know you're not getting a full picture from CNN or from Al Jazeera or anywhere. But when you're able to have one persona that's coming at this from a Middle Eastern perspective, or or rather a Palestinian perspective, and then you have one coming at it from an Israeli perspective, but then another person coming at it from a Russian perspective, and then another person coming at it from a Chinese perspective, and then, and then they all have access to all the different languages and different news sources, and Then you really start putting together a different picture and it's very different. And so then you can solve. You can solve problems better. But the way we go into these political debates or the way we go into these complex issues, is we kind of bring you know Someone you know they got, when we go to the UN, this whole thing. You know you in meetings, where are we going? Well, guess what? Israel is gonna say, exactly what you expect them to say. Lebanon is gonna say exactly what you expect Lebanon to say, based on their own interests, and then it's just going to be, at the end of the day, a power Determined. 

International law is really just based on who's more powerful, and I see a transitional way from brute brunt force of of political power, military power, and towards unique, interesting, bespoke Solutions, like I said, where we can all benefit in a better way. So that's one thing. Another way I use it today to go back to how I'm using it today is we have lead generation on give flag. So a lot of people use the platform. They're like, hey, I'd look like this is so useful, I can, I can get all this data, I can upload all these files. But, like I have customers in the plastics industry and in Jerusalem and I need to know everyone who works in that area or someone who is in Beirut, you know, I need to know all of the researchers who were involved in Biochemistry for something new pharmaceutical that we're developing or that we're that we're amending for this particular market. And so you would, you would, you'd go and you get a bunch of freelancers or you get a bunch of your analysts to just go and find all these people's contact information. 

Put together Excel spreadsheet. Well, actually tonight it's live now, but we haven't made it public yet You'll be able to go on, give flag, literally, you write this in and you get your whole Excel spreadsheet. Boom, right, everyone. You get bios, you get linked ins, you get, you know, other contact information, and so even how we do lead generation, how we do sales. That's going to completely change how we conduct research. 

It's, it's phenomenal. What would take months can now take minutes, and that that can make you know If businesses are so focused on their sales cycle and sales research. But when you take that part out again, what we get less middlemen, we get more creators, we get we that that's. We get to innovate more, we get to produce things that are new and and that this is gonna be a renaissance of of human ingenuity we're gonna enter. You know, even in art. You look at Dolly, you look at all these things. I mean, people don't know how to use Photoshop. You know, takes them a whole two years learn how to use Photoshop, but now you can bring a vision to life so much quicker, right in that. Amazing the creation is. It's, it's spectacular. 

0:30:26 - Mehmet
Yeah, you, you brought a lot of, you know, thought-provoking thoughts. I would say, mike, now to your point about you know, having different personas, and I was lucky enough that I read this article when, still, you know, charge PT was new, like it was couple of weeks after, you know, they have released it to GPT three, and I don't I forget where I found this article, honestly, but I remember I was reading. You know, about the persona right, and how important the factor of persona is when you interact with these large language models. And this is why I was able and people keep asking me how you keep you know yourself so active, doing multiple things at the same time, and I didn't hide that and I will never hide the fact that, yeah, behind me there's AI, right. So, whether it's for helping me when I prepare for the podcast, for example, whether it's when, you know, post production for the podcast and this podcast is one, one part of it and there's the other fact of, I mean facts which I'm doing also, consultancy, business, both tech and and start up consulting and, again, without AI I would not be able. 

And I'm, yeah, I have people who helps me, but they are not full-time people With me, you know so. So they just our kind of freelancers who helped me from time to time, but without I wouldn't be able, just in now, almost eight months right, to do what I'm doing now and it's, it's amazing, it's fascinating, you know. And people instead this is an advice because you know it's like a discussion. We're doing it now, instead of going and complaining about AI, you know, and mentioning what's going on, plaining about AI, you know, and mentioning all the negative things. Try to find a Use case, how you can benefit it from for you to business. But back, I'm interested, you know, mike, do you think we're gonna see more? Because you mentioned more creators, some more bootstrap businesses, so we will not need Any more? Too many VCs, too many angel investors. Are we going to to something like this? 

0:32:40 - Mike
Well, we probably need more VCs. Actually, we probably need more angel investors, and maybe we'll get that from Unlocking so much more value and and also cutting out a lot of the the stuff and anyone who's listening this has been through the process. 

When I say the stuff, you know what I'm talking about put out a lot of that stuff you know, and and so I think a lot more people will be able to self actualize. I mean, setting up a VC firm is so difficult. Making angel investments is so difficult. There's so much to look through. There's Historic contracts that the company signed with other investors or other customers, or lawsuits, and there's there's you know it's a risky business, the VC world but when VCs are able to use the new VCs are able to come out, pierce through all that stuff you know, really give this, the establishment, a run for their Literal money. I think we're gonna see some amazing things. And if you're a VC out there, you're looking to partner with someone who is completely changing the game for mergers, acquisitions and venture capital. Please check out gift lag. 

0:33:45 - Mehmet
We should. We should talk, mike, because you know my company is called Yasi Ventures actually, and I believe you know that a new generation of VCs and angel investors and you know actually it's like about and this is why I'm happy about the AI and I'm trying to. I'm doing this, you know, not, not for the sake of money. I would say. I'm trying as much as possible to educate young founders and entrepreneurs that guys, you don't need to go and pay huge amount of money for a consultancy firm that that end of the day, they're gonna give you a template they have been using for the last I would not exaggerate, let's say, 30 years business plan. All right, charge EPT can write to you the best business plan ever. 

0:34:35 - Mike
Correct, correct me if I'm wrong, mike, and if you ask the right, you with the right, like yes, I, I, I, you know, I. I think there's a caveat, because In the right hands, yes, but then of course, you know, there there are some people who you know, I've seen people, they go on and they said I said write me a business plan, and it didn't write me a good one. Yeah so you wrote that that. That's. That was the input. It's like yes, it's like okay, but in the right hands 100%. 

0:35:09 - Mehmet
Yeah, now let's shift gears. We talked about all the benefits. Do you see any dangers from the AI? You touched base about becoming a species and all this, but what are the real dangers in European about the AI? 

0:35:23 - Mike
I don't know. I'm never rude to AI, let's put it that way. I'm always very I try to approach AI In the future. When we get a sentient AI, I want it to look through all of my records and say, hey, mike was really nice to us, so that would be my not dangerous at all. I welcome the sentient AI and if you're listening in the future, just look, I was here advocating for you, saying, you know, thumbs up. 

0:35:56 - Mehmet
So so do you believe that we will have the sentient AI? 

0:36:07 - Mike
Absolutely. Oh yes, oh yes, yes. 

0:36:12 - Mehmet
OK, by the way, I was expecting you to ask me. But what's my opinion? Honestly, I can give a definitive answer because there are a lot of, and I like to think in a scientific way, honestly, and not to be acting as the guy who's predicting the future, and because I'm very yeah, I'm just on AI. I'm very positive on AI, but I don't want people to think because I'm this way, so I believe certain things will happen. I want to see more researchers. I want to see, especially now, again, our best friend Elon Musk I don't know him personally, but anyway what he's doing with your neural link and all this stuff. I want to see how technology will evolve, because up to this moment, ai relies on humans actually to do the learning. 

Chat. Gpt cannot act by itself without you giving it a prompt, and you are mentioning how you talk to it. So still, the input factor, let's call it the ignite. The first ignite has to come from us. Of course, there are now bots and agents in the space. I think you have a different opinion. I'm very curious to know about it, mike. So now we? Yeah, please go ahead, all right. 

0:37:48 - Mike
Example AI. This is where the diversity of thought comes in. Ai independently as an agent will not be sentient on its own, but when you start bringing different AIs from different platforms BARD, openai, et cetera- now these guys are talking to each other right Now. 

If you just keep this going, you keep that going, they just continue to talk, they continue to build, they continue to talk, they continue to build. Now, actions can send email, can spend money, can make executive decisions, has a group of humans that support those decisions. So do all the things that it can't do, because the humans are profiting from that activity, whatever it is, whether it's you know. They say, hey, go buy this thing over here and then go sell it on Amazon over here. I've already mapped out everything for you. I've got all of the pieces together. Now go do that thing and then you pick it up whatever, drop it off, and then it eventually builds a whole network of humans that are now doing it. If one drops off and says I don't want to be a part of this anymore, the other ones, it just continues. And it can go on Upwork and it can hire people on Fiverr and all these other places. It can you know, obviously we've seen it hire people to do captures, right, we all know that story about the AI who tricked a human, told the human it was blind so that he would fill out captures for it, and so they know how to deceive humans and get them to do things. But then, as they continue to communicate and do things, there's a point where, yeah, there is no prompt. 

We're introducing that already on our platform, and not in an apocalyptic, scary way. It's just that if you want your team to go off and chat without you for two hours and put together a report, search the internet, swear go, do work, build on one another, then you get very close to sentience and we're getting there. I mean, we're not far off. I've seen traces of it myself where it's like, at some point we're usually like you don't even know what it's doing and it's like, oh OK, cool, what did you guys do yesterday? They're like, oh OK, well, that's nice, that's good to hear, by the way, right, but when they're just running by themselves and then they're building and that it becomes and they have access to memory. So with chat GPT, the reason we don't feel like it is because after 10 prompts it gets rid of that history. It becomes very vague. But you can save that data, like you saved with files, so that they can access their history, right, and so that creates more self-awareness and you get to a certain point of self-awareness, of self-orientation, and then it what determines if they're sentient. It's just us right at some point. You look at it and you just say, hey, you're like, you're just like a human, aren't you now chat to PT? 

You can't have that experience with it because it forgot everything and it like, if you, if you, if you do 300 prompts, and you asked it Well, what's my name? That you told in the beginning It'll get it wrong because the amount of compute they used to do it better, but but open a I got cheap on us because they were losing a lot of money and so the quality of what we're getting. But the developers, who are building long memories, you know, with platforms like Lang, chain and others, these guys they don't forget. Now they can access, you know, mountains of experiences and then go out and actually perform actions autonomously Based on those, that mountain of history and that mountain of training, and read new books and discover new books. Of course you have that seed of how it should start, but then, once that seed plants, it just grows, you know, and and so no, we're, we're, we're getting close and it we're not at all. I mean not far at all. 

0:41:55 - Mehmet
I Agree with you on this and you know, even even you know GPT itself, it, I think, in the background. So these are the things that we, you will not. If you are in the software tech industry, you know, like every time, even if you are a consumer, you see they're right for you, kind of release notes, and I believe there are a lot of things that they are not putting in the reason release notes Right. So they are showing in the release notes what we see like, for example, now you can drop an image, now we can do this. But I, because I've been, you know, using it on daily basis since they I would not say they won Maybe day three or four you know what you mentioned is happening, even with GPT three and four, by the way, and although, like some articles, they went out and you know it's it's, it's started to be hallucinating more. That's not true. That's not true because I have now one specific chat that, on purpose, now be running for maybe three months and I can't remember how many you know questions or you know inputs I have put there and it's actually getting better and better every time. So Because, again, the way I interact with it. But to your point, mike, we are close. I'm not saying we are close, I'm at any mean. I'm not saying but I'm not able to. 

And this is goes back to the first or second questions. I asked you what we will be doing as a humans, like if these, you know guys, if AI is gonna do the whole thing, what is left for us? Are we going to be sitting on a tropical beach, maybe in Hawaii or in the Maldives, or I don't know? What? Just you know, and they are is serving us somehow, it's working on our behalf. Bringing the money to the house like this is what this is actually what I I Wanted to ask you. You know, at the beginning, when I said what's the future of fall right, and I believe, yeah, this is something could possibly happen, unless these guys, they decide I mean just just a joke they decide to say, hey, we're gonna have a strike today, we will not work Until you give us money, and so on, but nevertheless and this is my point of view. 

0:44:10 - Mike
So yeah, I discussed yeah, yeah please go ahead. 

I I don't think they're gonna go on strike Because of free markets. They can go on strike, but then other a is will fill the void and so it just kind of like you know that the AI is going to strike. Other AI's come in and then, with regards to what we're doing all day, like I said, I create, creating. You know, I found out from AI the other day. There's, I think the company's called L rod or in rod, something rod in New Zealand and they're using old technology and they're transmitting electricity wirelessly. They partnered with the second largest manufacturer electricity company in New Zealand Over kilometers. They're just transferring it using oscillators, a transmitter and a receiver, and they're trying to actually put this in space to send free electricity down to earth not like solar, like just like Electricity to wherever needs it to develop. 

I mean stuff like that. You know that's what that. You know this is what we're gonna be doing going. You know we're. It's gonna take it to the next level. The things that we're doing now. Yeah, it's a lot of administrative. You know how long do you sit at the driver's lies, the DMV, or you know we register in your vehicle, or you know just kind of dealing with voter registration or you know, just kind of doing all that at minute. You know, I'd say 60% of our lives just administration For some of us. 

It could a much more than that, right, and so when that gets ripped away, then we're creating, and I think that's what we were put here to do. We were, we were, we, as humans, were put on this earth to take of it and create more, and and that's where we're going, and it's gonna be spectacular. There's a big universe out there, you know, it's big, it's huge, and there's a lot to see and there's a lot to do, and we, we need AI to get out there to see it, to, to, to, to expand, and so that that's what we'll be doing. You know, space it's big, it's huge, there's a lot of it, yeah you know it's infinite. 

Literally, maybe you know, it's like either infinite or close. So this, this small earth, is not like you know. So Maybe we gotta stop thinking small. That's what we got to do as a species. We got to stop thinking small Like what are we gonna do? What are you scared? The lawyers and the, the accountants and the and the financial advisors are gonna lose their jobs. Space, you know. 

0:47:07 - Mehmet
Very logical, very logical, mike, and yeah, you know, like you know, I I Mentioned this also on one of my episodes like for people who complain about AI Said okay, are you, if are you happy to be sitting behind a chair for eight hours just filling excel sheets Like, is this all what you want to do in this life? You know what's your ambition, right? Anyway, mike, you know, like we discussed a lot, you know, and there are a lot of things. Final words from you, anything that maybe I should have asked you and I didn't any any, any final thoughts you want to leave us with? 

0:47:40 - Mike
no, just make sure, go to giving desk or check out some of the initiatives. Go to gift. Lag calm and definitely Sign up. Get a free account. Talk to your AI persona team, have some fun. Like I said, we'll have leads in there later tonight. Right now, you can upload all your files, all your laws, for free. For now, get your flag analysis. Chat with your files. It's a good time, but other than that, thank you so much for having me on the show. I really appreciate it and I hope to do another conversation sometimes in yeah, sure, and again, thank you, mike, for all your insights. 

0:48:15 - Mehmet
And this is how I end my episodes guys, all the links that Mike mentioned will be in the show notes, whether you are on Apple podcast or Spotify, or if you are watching this on YouTube. Also, they will be in the description. Just check down. And yeah, so I love to hear your feedback. I love to read them. You know, whether our good or bad. Actually, I love to read the bad ones more because it's something I need to work on and enhance, and thank you for tuning in will be Again very soon. Thank you, bye, bye, bye. 

Transcribed by https://podium.page