March 18, 2024

#310 G. Kofi Annan: Blending Technology and Authenticity for Startups Brand Success

#310 G. Kofi Annan: Blending Technology and Authenticity for Startups Brand Success

In this episode of the CTO Show with Mehmet, guest G. Kofi Annan, a brand strategist and technologist, shares his insights on improving company visibility, engagement, and revenue through branding. With experience working with large corporations like Puma and Pfizer, as well as emerging companies, Annan emphasizes the importance of storytelling and making meaningful connections with target markets. Drawing from his upbringing in Ghana and Liberia and professional pivot at Saatchi and Saatchi, he discusses the evolution of branding beyond logos and colors to encompass the values, stories, and unique selling propositions of a business.

 

Annan also delves into the significance of understanding cultural nuances for successful international market entry, leveraging AI and technology in branding, and the critical role of customer relationships. The episode highlights practical strategies for startups and established businesses to carve out niches, differentiate themselves, and achieve growth through effective branding and storytelling.

 

Here is the link provided by Kofi:

https://thebrandsensei.co/cto

 

More about Kofi:

G. Kofi Annan is a Brand Strategist, Technologist, Advisor, and Investor with a 20+ year career spanning over 200 brand-building efforts. Kofi has an impressive track record that includes working with global companies like PUMA, Pfizer, and Mercedes Benz, and innovative startups like Neurocrine and SwatchOn. He distills insights, skills, and tools into actionable strategies to help executives, founders, and entrepreneurs stand out and grow their brands the smarter way. Kofi's ability to blend humor, insights, and thought-provoking stories inspires people into action.

https://gkofiannan.com

 

00:00 Welcome to the CTO Hour: Meet Kofi, the Brand Strategist

02:40 Kofi's Journey: From Ghana to Global Brand Strategist

07:11 The Essence of Branding in Business Success

10:54 Navigating Cultural Nuances in Global Markets

17:44 Leveraging Technology for Authentic Storytelling in Branding

23:27 The Power of Connection: Customer Experience and Technology

24:11 Leveraging Data and Automation in Branding

25:08 The Core Elements of Brand Development

25:41 Understanding Key Branding Metrics: Customer Acquisition and Lifetime Value

26:18 The Power of Storytelling in Reducing Customer Acquisition Costs

31:59 The Role of AI in Enhancing Branding for Startups and Scaleups

36:16 Navigating the Hype Cycle of AI in Branding

44:23 The Importance of Relationship and Personal Touch in Branding

45:21 Final Thoughts and Advice on Branding Success

Transcript

Mehmet: Hello and welcome back to a new episode of the CTO or show with Mehmet today. I'm very pleased Will coming with me, joining me from Texas, the U. S. Kofi, Kofi, the way I love to do it is I keep it to my guests to do themselves because I have a theory. No [00:01:00] one can introduce someone else better than themselves.

Mehmet: So the floor is yours. Tell us a little bit about you and what you do currently. 

Kofi: Yes, Mehmet. Pleasure to be here. Glad to have this conversation. As you mentioned, my name is G. Kofi Annan. I'm a brand strategist and technologist. And what does that mean? Essentially, I work with companies, you know, some large companies like Puma and Pfizer, which have been my clients in the past and some emerging companies, which is where I spend a lot of my times now.

Kofi: And I help them really increase their visibility within certain markets, whether it be a new or resisting market, I also help them increase the engagement. So just because you're. You know, you're visible and people know of you doesn't necessarily mean that engaging you in a meaningful way. So I helped them increase that engagement with the right people.

Kofi: And then ultimately, particularly for the businesses and the clients that I work with, it's about generating that revenue. That's that, um, that feedback around, you know, how are you able to grow your business? And so it's really about the visibility, the engagement and the, um, [00:02:00] the revenue for me and really, and, and, and.

Kofi: Through my years, I've been doing this for about 15, 20 years. You know, I've seen in many multiple industries in different, um, both domestic in the U S but then in international math markets. And it's really, I've seen some really good, um, ways and approaches to increase that visibility, engagement, and revenue, um, depending on the dynamics of the market.

Kofi: And we know the market these days markets, these days are changing. So, um, so rapidly. So, you know, the, the, Being able to grow a brand is really where I come in and having that impact in the society and the market that you're looking, that you and your business are looking to have. 

Mehmet: Great. And thank you again, Kofi, for being on the show today.

Mehmet: Now, maybe it's a little bit traditional question, but I like to ask also my guests, like what, you know, made you be interested in this domain? Because You know branding and we will talk like shortly about it in detail, especially because you know, we we cover about [00:03:00] tech and startups, so What what attracted you to be in this field?

Mehmet: And you know, maybe if you can tell us also like what was the most I would say attractive Thing that you said, okay I know that I need to be in this field. 

Kofi: Sure. So, um, you know, I, I always look at things at seasons and adaptation and evolutions. Right. And I love this question because, um, this is the same question that kind of question that I ask my clients, you know, why did, why are you, why are you here?

Kofi: What, what brought you here? And there's a lot of, of, of nuggets in there for me. Um, I grew up in Ghana, um, West Africa, um, for the first five years of my life, I moved to Liberia where I spent another five or six years. Years before moving to the U S with my family. So I've seen different interactions between businesses.

Kofi: My father was in business. My mother had always had a business, um, at home. She was a [00:04:00] seamstress, um, for a good part of our early lives. So just kind of seeing them build out to different businesses, um, and interacting with different markets and different, um, Different customer basis. That's, you know, in the back of my mind, that's where I got my exposure to business.

Kofi: Now, why, why my, this is the role that I'm playing in business. Well, initially I thought it was, you know, I was a creative person. I like to tell stories and such, so I was attracted to that. But as I grew up and I started telling more stories in different ways, I even had a, um, a business myself called a Nancy clothing company, which was really unpopular, um, uh, some years ago.

Kofi: I realized that. A business is a product, which is, which is where most people focus. And really the storytelling aspect and the connection aspect, which I love, I figured out that's, that's my superpower, right? Like I, I love connecting people. I love people helping people tell stories. I help love helping people make sense of, of the [00:05:00] interactions that they're having with their customers or their, or their teams.

Kofi: And I found out that I was good at it. You know, um, I would say the, the, the, the main. Point I could point a pinpoint where I really, um, took, um, pivoted was when I was working at Saatchi and Saatchi some years ago. Um, and I was actually in development. Um, so I was managing a web development team there, you know, this early days of kind of web development and such.

Kofi: And I had happened to crawl in because again, I was looking at vehicles to tell stories and I learned web development, long story, but either way, um, and, but being in a creative. Environment like Saatchi and Saatchi was a huge global advertising agency. I got a chance to see a lot of the different, um, positions, you know, on the creatives, which most people know about the development.

Kofi: Obviously I was imagining manager, Dutty, production strategists, you know, and. You know, once I was doing that, I B I realized that I'm not a great developer. I'm not a great designer. I know enough about business. That's all good. But really again, my [00:06:00] superpower was in that those connections. And ultimately I made that pivot professionally to start, not just manage the development team, but start having those conversations with clients about what is the value of web and, you know, web, web as a communication tool and how they, how.

Kofi: Saatchi and me and my team are able to use that to help them accelerate their business. And I love that experience being in there with those clients, hearing their pain points, helping them solve those problems. And I, and in, you know, luckily I was in that environment where, you know, there was a name for it.

Kofi: It was called a strategist, which even to this day, my mother still doesn't know what that means. I know, I think most people don't know what that means, but, um, but yeah, that's when I realized that I loved having those conversations and helping businesses in that way. So. Yes, ultimately. And I've been doing that for about 10, 15 years.

Kofi: Solid, just specifically as a strategist and, um, yeah, I'm bringing those gaps. 

Mehmet: Great. I love also like, uh, [00:07:00] uh, seeing people like yourself, Kofi, like who are not only doing great job, but they do it in a passionate way, which I can, I can feel it even miles away. Now I want to little bit focus on, on the branding part, right?

Mehmet: Do you think that. It's something that businesses usually they don't give it enough care, I would say, to, because it's part of the marketing, correct me if I'm wrong. Um, it's part of a bigger strategy, of course, but sometimes we see people still stuck in old fashioned ways. techniques. So I want you to highlight to us why branding is important and how really it can shift the position of a business.

Kofi: Sure. Sure. Yeah, this, this, um, I would say that, you know, there's, there's kind of two sets of, uh, frame of mind, people who are not in [00:08:00] my, my, um, space, space. Um, there's kind of two frames of minds, right? So there's exact, um, there's the, Old school, right. Um, or traditional way of thinking about branding, which is someone who's, who says I need a logo, I need colors, you know, so that's a creative end, right.

Kofi: You know, logo, a brand, a brand is a logo and colors, right. Once I, once I have that, which, you know, if you're, if you're a tech startup, especially, or you're, or you're in, in tech specifically, and that, you know, you're more product and, and, um, product focused, you think that that's all you need to look at.

Kofi: And You can get tools these days that can generate any of those, right? So that's kind of the traditional way. There are other people who, you know, I guess, who, where I try to move others, who understand that a brand is more than that. Um, a brand is a representation of the product, the values, the stories, the, you know, essentially, uh, uh, of their, um, their company and where, what their companies bring into market.

Kofi: They understand that. [00:09:00] However, they realize that there's value in that, but it's a crowded market, right? So there's kind of two sets of people that I normally deal with. And both of them have different perspectives on brand. They see value the first group, not as much in the sense of the, they really think is commoditized.

Kofi: Um, the second group, they see the, the kind of more holistic value, but again, you know, um, Really prioritizing, depending on the kind of product and kind of industry and particularly in B2B industries, um, prioritizing that sometimes, you know, mentally they can't really make the connection, um, and how I, you know, my, my, my, how I talk to both of those people, the first group who think that it's a colors and the logo.

Kofi: I say, yes, it is, but really colors and logos don't make a product. Right. And really the product is really about the product. The colors and the logos and why you, the question that you asked me in the beginning, you know, why you. Even for investors, that's [00:10:00] all part of the brand. That's all part of the story that you're telling.

Kofi: You need to tell a story about why someone should have a relationship or engage with you and your product and your business. And it's with the second group, it is about the crowded market. And really I help them really narrow down. Okay. What is the differentiator that I have? Cause they further along in that, um, in, in that, uh, understanding of sophistication, what is the secret sauce?

Kofi: And not necessarily from a product perspective, it could be part of a product, but you know, who are the founders? Why did they do this? You know, I told you the story about me growing up in Ghana and Liberia, like, you know, all those things that we take for granted as, as founders and, um, and owners bringing that forth.

Kofi: To make that emotional connection to specific markets and specific audiences, right? And that's where you start. And then from there it just goes on and that's all part of being able to build in a brand. 

Mehmet: Absolutely. Now, one thing which when I was preparing and you know, we had a little [00:11:00] bit of chat before and because you work with international customers.

Mehmet: So one thing Usually, which when I talk myself to startup founders, right? So, so of course there are like the early days, you know, everything, but then at some stage they need to start scale. And one part of the scaling strategy is to go after global markets. So if they are based in the U S they would go to Europe, they would go to Asia and vice versa.

Mehmet: Right now, in your work across different cultures and market, how do you approach, you know, The concept of understanding and leveraging that there are some cultural nuances, let's call them, or differences, and how you advise your clients usually to take care of these cultural differences to have successful new market entries.[00:12:00] 

Kofi: Yeah, they're, they're, yeah, a lot of my clients, whether they're, um, they're thinking about it now or, you know, yeah, they've kind of reached a certain level of momentum and scale and they've maybe, you know, um, grown bigger than their current market, they, they do start have thinking through that and, um, I'll talk about two different, um, uh, kinds of clients in that regard.

Kofi: So, um, some years ago in 2010, specifically for the 2010 world cup, uh, Puma, the, uh, athletic company was looking to, you know, be part, you know, be part of the world cup, right. You know, advertise market X, Y, and Z. It's a huge platform, you know, athletics, you know, makes sense. They didn't have the budget. Nike, who was the official sponsor.

Kofi: Um, so yeah, so, you know, we complain about budget, but even sometimes Puma doesn't have enough budget. Um, they didn't have the big budget, but they were looking to make an impact. Right. A lot, a lot of eyes were going to be on the World Cup. Um, where I [00:13:00] came in and me and my team, we came in to say, okay, what is the key differential for Puma?

Kofi: What, what area can we carve out? Um, and, um, Within that context, we, we looked at, okay, what is the context of World Cup? And in that year, that was the first year that the World Cup was happening in Africa, right? Or South Africa specifically. And we re we found, you know, having conversations with Puma, we found that Puma has a legacy, um, had traditionally always sponsored African teams in other World Cups.

Kofi: So that's a gem. That's an insight that we could go with. So how do we make it relevant in the current day and how we look at the current, um, the cultural, um, aspect, um, in that case, we started having conversations with people who represented the audience of that World Cup, you know, the modern African, you know, international person, you know, again, to cap, to, to capitalize both on the connection with, with, um, African, African, but then also help that to propel the, the message.

Kofi: And yeah, so we dove deep dip. We did some ethnography, which is. [00:14:00] Essentially following people around. And this is, you know, 20, um, 20, 2009, 2010. So we didn't have too much of social media there, you know, not too much of a, uh, on, uh, uh, uh, context online, particularly in the African market. So a lot of that were, were kind of going to visit people in their homes, asking them questions.

Kofi: Again, I'm trying to tease out those cultural nuances that get past our individual biases. Even me as an African, you know, my location being in the U S there's uh, assumptions I have about, um, About, you know, what makes sense and what attracts someone who's, who lives in Africa, um, in different parts of Africa.

Kofi: So we did ethnographies, we did, we visited, you know, different cultural hubs, so whether it be technology hubs or athletic hubs, and kind of, we talked to people online. Um, so again, just kind of teasing out those nuances. Why do they do the things they do? And then obvi obviously, um, once we gathered that research, then we brought it back and said, okay, so now what does that mean for Puma?

Kofi: How do we make the two? How do we make that relevant for the marketing and the messaging? And [00:15:00] that's different, um, structures and processes that would go through there. The more recent one that I had was a single, um, sorry, a South Korean, um, uh, textiles company. Um, so software, a SAS company, which, um, Leverage, uh, leverages this, um, South Korean textile market and essentially digitize it, bring it, bring it, um, bring it to, uh, the global market.

Kofi: And they wanted to enter the U S market. Right. So it's kind of like in that, in that, um, kind of diverse and with them. And this was, um, last year, I think it was when we, well, uh, I've been working with them for a few years, but you know, one of the key things there was the different differences, culturally and their startup.

Kofi: So they done some funding and such, but the cultural difference in assumptions between the South Korean market, and in this case, The, the U S fashion B2B market, right? Big, you would assume that they're similar to both kind of textiles and such, you know, same industry. But when we, when we dialed, when we engage and we started having conversations with [00:16:00] their current customers, right?

Kofi: Okay. Who are your current customers? How did they, what, why did they use your brand X, Y, and Z? And then also started having conversations with their future customers in the U S. Um, from a role and responsibilities perspective, same customer, but in the U S we found that there was a nuance in the difference, right?

Kofi: South, South Korean, um, uh, customers were very practical in their engagements with this, with this, um, textile manufacturer, very kind of, um, this is what we want, you know, there was, it was pretty straightforward. Whereas with a U S, um, based customer base, um, and, They, they, they were more invested in storage, particularly again, fashion, textiles.

Kofi: There were really a lot of more creative people, a lot of more, um, uh, storytelling people who really value creatives, right. A lot more than, you know, other markets. So that was the gap that we saw where the company was used to having to kind of do more practical and product based conversations within the, um, within the Asian market.

Kofi: But then we had to, [00:17:00] um, change that and elevate that within the, I'm really excited about that. Um, I mean, I don't know how you could respond to that. Um, but that being said, you know, Converging. To the, to the public about their lives. Um, So I guess one of the other things I wanted to speak to in, in terms of, what are you kind of looking forward to as we kind of move forward?

Kofi: I think there's a lot of them. to understand that, you know, markets Different international markets change, but I would even argue that with the acceleration of technology, local markets change as well, and they change really quickly. I think that's, that's where a lot of my, um, the clients, my clients are struggling to really make that connection.

Kofi: And that's where I usually help them. 

Mehmet: That's a great, like use case, I would say, Kofi. Now, like we are living in technology, fast changing technology phase. Yeah. But at the same time, you know, even in the branding, and you mentioned this couple of minutes ago, [00:18:00] you need to keep the storytelling, which is very, it's something which is, you know, personal, right?

Mehmet: So it's something that comes from us. So how do you leverage the technology to keep the authenticity, I would say, of the story that that you're trying company, whether like it's a startup or a full fledged business, they want to convey without, you know, losing this, you know, Oh, okay. Like these guys, like, look, they are very, very authentic.

Mehmet: Right. But at the same time, you need to use technology and you don't need to be as a customer to feel, Oh, like, it looks like it made up, right. It's not convincing. So what is, I would say the secret sauce for a proper, technology adoption when it comes to, to, to branding and, you know, utilizing the storytelling.

Kofi: Yes. Uh, stories are about people, right. And, and people and their experiences, [00:19:00] right. And, you know, particularly in the business, um, aspects, it's about the people behind the company. In and around the company, again, why they started, you know, what they're trying to do, what is the value of their products, you know, all those kinds of things, how, you know, why, why them, a lot of this, particularly for, um, tech founders and companies that are, that are growing a lot of the conversations they're having with the investors, right.

Kofi: You know, it's kind of funny when we're talking about investors, people, you know, think, think of a different way. And they try to kind of tell that story through not just the product features of function, but when it comes to audiences, um, or customers, um, you Sometimes we, we missed the mark with the mark there.

Kofi: Um, the, that storytelling is very important. And, you know, I, I always, one exercise that I, um, give a lot of my clients. When they're struggling to figure out like, yeah, storytelling, you know, I'm not Disney, right. You know, I'm, I'm selling a product that's a textile ordering system. Right. It's pretty, you know, in their mind, kind of, um, [00:20:00] straightforward.

Kofi: But again, at the end of the day, you're talking. Those buyers, those customers are people who wants to feel close to, especially in this day and age, they want to feel close to. They want to identify, self identify with whatever choice that they're making as far as a product. And they have, I mean, let's not get it, uh, uh, confused.

Kofi: These days, there are more than enough choices for any kind of product or service, right? They're, I mean, they're, everyone with the advent of technology and connection of social media and such, everyone has more than enough choices. Well, most people have more than enough choices, even if their choices are less than others.

Kofi: Um, so why, again, why you? So that's where the personal connection and how you're telling that personal story comes in. And it doesn't necessarily have to be the founder led and, you know, kind of all those kinds of things, but sometimes it's about, you know, what is the problem that customers trying to solve in their business?

Kofi: Sometimes it's not just a, um, I want to do my taxes. So if you think of [00:21:00] accounting software, I want to do my taxes. Sure. I could find something to do my taxes, but it's, I want to do my taxes with ease. And I want to do it with somebody who, that I trust based on, you know, my. My, the fact that my company is in, in, uh, it's, it's a law firm, right?

Kofi: So, so it's those, again, those nuances diving deep into that customer, um, or that user, uh, makeup, why they use it, who, who are they and what is the real problem? What did it, their thoughts, what are their fears? You know why, you know, and those are all the things that folks won't necessarily tell you it's not really evident, but with the technology that we have and the access that we have, we can go on social media and all the forums.

Kofi: We have a number of Reddits. We can definitely start to dive deep into, um, not just the functional value of products that somebody wants to buy, but the emotional and the connectivity, um, [00:22:00] that, that they're looking for. And then we weave the story from there. And a lot of times. It's just listening, you know, uh, when we're, when we're, um, when we're business owners and we're close to the product and we're really trying to, to, um, grow our business or bring it to a new market, we become very focused on, you know, the here now, what we want to do, but, um, it's what, what that focus is good for executing, but when it comes down to, uh, transforming or evolving or revolutionizing, or, um, It's about listening.

Kofi: It's about listening to the people that and what people are telling you what they're telling the conversation to tell each other. I'm working with a waste management company right now where that's the exercise we're going to. We're essentially just spending. We've spent a little bit of time just going through different forums.

Kofi: Um, and just like listening to what people are talking about. What is what is the. The, the gap that they see in the current [00:23:00] products, why, why are they doing, what is their day to day, like those kinds of things. And that's, you know, not everybody geeks out on it, like, like me. And that's kind of, again, where, where my superpower is.

Kofi: Cause I geek out on that and not just, not just hearing people's stories, but then also taking those stories and transforming them into something that a business could then, um, use as a platform to. Connect with that, that customer. So it is really about those, those stories and it's about connection.

Mehmet: Absolutely. I do to the point of connections, coffee. Now, I know that you, you, you mentioned this, uh, you know, um, to me before. And, uh, this is the main goal of creating, you know, the CDN. This branding and storytelling is to build the connection with customers and have, you know, what is known as customer experience.

Mehmet: Now, to me, you know, in any business, whether it's small or big, to me, you know, all what we do is to serve the customer because whatever product service [00:24:00] we are offering. So this is to solve a problem to my customer, right? Now to nurture this, And I know you like this topic and it's related to technology.

Mehmet: You need to have enough insights from data perspective. You need to leverage maybe some additional technologies, maybe to automate a few things. So I wanted to explain how, you know, I can measure, you know, what I aim to do was achieved using data and how also I can automate part of this branding journey.

Mehmet: down the road, especially, you know, in startup mode, uh, you have limited resources. You need to rely on multiple, you know, you're doing multiple things. You cannot get a lot of stuff with you. So you need to do a lot of handy things. So how they can leverage [00:25:00] also like automation to, to. Reach the ultimate goal that they want to 

Kofi: so I'll yes for for within that context Um, so we have we have a process that we work in that again I've been doing this for many many years and I've kind of teased out the key areas that branding or brand development efforts go faster And become smarter.

Kofi: And that's, you know, what we talked about before, which is the values of the company and the storytelling, the experience. And then also that last part is that impact. And I think that's where a lot of, um, tech focus brands kind of start with the impact, you know, the actual numbers to that point. I always, um, there are two key numbers that I associate with brand, with branding, that branding can affect and they're kind of metrics that lead up to that, but the two primary KPIs that I think would resonate with a lot of tech founders specifically are customer acquisition costs, right?

Kofi: What is it costing you [00:26:00] to get a customer? And customer lifetime value, right? How, how much is that customer worth over time? Right. And I think a lot of tech founders could, could really understand those two, two key KPIs, right. Um, and how does branding, uh, uh, uh, relate to that? Well, let's talk about customer, customer acquisition costs.

Kofi: Well, if you're a startup, you know, whether you have funding or not, or you're self funded or you have some momentum, you're probably, you're Um, trying to reduce that customer acquisition costs, right? You don't want to spend as much money on ads, especially, which is where a lot of people just kind of start going straight for ad advertising.

Kofi: And, you know, having been in the ad agency, I add a business for a while. Um, previously I could say that there's a place for that, but ads are not going to solve your problems right alone. Right. Um, or they do other things that they hear in the market, which is like, you know, Just do social media, right? But they don't really see the conversion rates.

Kofi: They don't really see the customer acquisition costs go down. [00:27:00] One of the things that I would say from a brand perspective is that you're, if you're not seeing that customer acquisition costs go down slowly, that means that there is a, people don't really understand the value, not off your products, but from a brand perspective, why you.

Kofi: Why, what is the value? Do you share my value? Do you make my life easier? Like, like all those, all that storytelling is really not coming, coming through, certainly not for the, the, um, the customers that you are, um, you have direct access to, but even for, for them, for their ability to amplify your, um, the relationship you have with them and the successes you have with them to their network, right?

Kofi: And that's what you want, right? So you want that amplification, um, beyond just the, the one to one, right? And that helps reduce your customer acquisition costs because, you know, essentially people are getting customers for you. So, um, that's where brand comes in. Right. I want to be able to tell people. So in the, in the case of, of, of my company, I have a, uh, my company names, the brand sensei.

Kofi: Okay. The brand [00:28:00] sensei does X, Y, and Z, you know, and by through those stories, how your customers are telling their friends and their family and their colleagues, the stories that you've enabled them to tell their, those people. Okay. Helps bring them, bring those people into the fold and obviously reduces your customer acquisition costs.

Kofi: Right. So that's, again, that's, that's where stories can help propel some of those kinds of things. Give them a short way, a short snippet of a way to tell the story. And then of course on board, you know, those customers. So again, that's the kind of mechanics of how branding can factor factor in. And you do have to understand those people, how those people, and then obviously customer, um, lifetime value is that experience.

Kofi: How are you, um, reinforcing the, the, you know, when they get, reach out to customer, uh, customer service, like how are you interacting with them? How are you giving them opportunities to reach out, you know, all those kinds of mechanics, and that's all feeds into your brand as well. You know, I know that I could expect fast delivery from Amazon.

Kofi: And, you know, I know that when I, when my. [00:29:00] Which happened just the other day, my delivery. I cannot, I don't know where it ended up. And, you know, I, I, as a matter of fact, I'm not going to go find it. I caught, I tell Amazon, I just want to order another one quickly. They don't even ask me too many questions because I'm a long time, um, uh, customer and they just, you know, kind of avoid that, that transaction and allow me to buy something again that adds to the Amazon brand.

Kofi: Right. So over time, I'm spending more time on Amazon because of that experience and that I associate with the brand, that feeling of ease of access and convenience. 

Mehmet: Absolutely. And I love this example, actually, Kofi, like, you know, this is what I, you know, to, and this is, you know, for people. Um, just to remind them when you started the conversation and you talk, it's not about the logo and you know, these are important things, but you know, this user experience, what, um, you know, bring you more business to your point because [00:30:00] people, uh, recommend good services, products to other people.

Mehmet: Uh, and I liked when you say it's not like about the ads, social media, all this, right. So of course you can create some kind of buzz over there, right. But buzz is not branding, right? So, so, so, so yeah, unfortunately, you know, in, in, in, especially in the tech domain, uh, what I see happening is one startup or established business, they come up with a nice theme, let's call it.

Mehmet: And then we start to see everyone following the same thing, almost copy pasting the full story. And I liked when you say coffee, like, okay. Why you because there are 10 Companies that they claim they do the same thing how you're gonna differentiate yourself. And I think this is where you know this branding not only from marketing, I would say [00:31:00] Copywriting and you know social media ad plays a role is how you convey us and honestly, I'm very biased by the way, you know Apple used to do on at the time of Steve Jobs, but how they used to do this storytelling thing.

Mehmet: And, you know, you know, when, when Steve Jobs asked like what we want people to think when they think about the brand Apple, right? So, you know, he wanted people to, to see things different way and think in a different way. It's not like about just a, you know, piece of hardware. And, you know, I love this, you know, stories too much.

Mehmet: Uh, although I am not by any mean a marketing guru or, you know, I just love to see what succeed. I love to try many things and what you just said Kofi, you know, really, uh, proved me right, which is, which is a good thing. Now, One thing I want to, to ask you, and you know, again, like, um, during the preparation, we discussed this.

Mehmet: [00:32:00] So AI, right? So, and you mentioned a little bit at the Bing as well. So how do you think AI can help, uh, startups and even scale apps to get that level up and to be able to compete with the larger corporation when it comes to branding? Um, 

Kofi: I, you, you hit the nail on the head in the, in the, in the sense that it is about competing with the larger players, um, you know, as a startup or a new entrance into even, even a, uh, a new market.

Kofi: So you've been talking about the, the, uh, textile, uh, startup that I was working with entering new market. No one knows you. Um, and you, and that doesn't, and you want them to know you and you want them to trust you, you want to have that credibility, you want them to use your product, but, um, you don't have the budget, right?

Kofi: Like you're, you don't have the endless budget. You [00:33:00] don't have time, right? Even if you do have the budget, you know, your, your, your, your talents and resources might be limited. Um, so you're trying to do a lot more. With less. And you know, and in that regard, AI is a great enabler. Now, is AI going to solve your problems?

Kofi: No, it isn't. And I always use this term, and it's a, it's a, it's a term that I, I think a lot of, uh, text, uh, startups and, you know, people in, in data analytics will, uh, will, will specifically, will, will resonate with them, which is garbage in, garbage out. So, uh, or, or in, um, in American layman's terms, you know, uh, put in lipstick on a pig.

Kofi: So any of those analogies, right, which is, which is to say that if you don't, if you're, if the core of what you're doing and who you are, it's not, um, together and you don't have the right platform and you don't have the right processes. AI is only going to amplify what you already have. [00:34:00] So it's going to make, and, and, and in a lot of times it's going to make it faster and it's going to have a bigger, uh, uh, impact negative impact on your business.

Kofi: Google, for instance, is going through a little bit of that. I mean, I posted something on my LinkedIn about, you know, their, their, uh, uh, entrance into, uh, into AI and AI model models where they've been releasing. I mean, if you've been following that, that space, they've been releasing seemingly a new AI model or upgrade or products like almost every other week, and even internally in their company, they can't even keep track, right.

Kofi: And Google has. Endless budget. We understand that, but they can't get it together. Ultimately for me, that means that internally, they don't have the right processes. They don't have the right, um, framework. They're not having the right conversations internally, and they don't understand externally, they're, um, the right markets do they need to be a generalist AI company who knows, but again, so, and they have the tool.

Kofi: So going back to what you're saying from a, um, from a scale up, a startup, a [00:35:00] scale up, um, AI is only going to amplify what you have. And the good thing about it is that, um, you can have what you need faster. And what I mean by that is that interviewing your, your customers, or even understanding, um, your brand value or understanding your customer acquisition costs, or even, um, getting the right contents to market, um, for your audience to, to, um, to convert our audiences.

Kofi: AI is great at enabling all of that. But again, you have to have the right process. You have to write that, have the right, um, frame of mind. And that's kind of, you know, where, within the space that we work in, Um, that's where our process comes in, where, you know, we're able to inject our process, um, into, uh, the companies that we work with and help them build out the platforms, the strength of those platforms between the values, the experience, the stories, um, the, and even the, the data gathering and data analysis, we're able to inject that, that framework into their business and help with the help [00:36:00] of a tool like AI, it accelerates things that much faster.

Kofi: So, you know, The value of AI really as a tool is in the process that you have the process, the stringent process that you have in different parts of your area of that, that you're focusing on and then hit AI accelerates that. Um, unfortunately we're going through a, a state now where, um, just kind of, if you, if you've been around long enough, you remember when either the.

Kofi: com days or when everybody was creating a website and, you know, you had so many. Really bad websites being popped out. So it's, it's, it's the hype cycle, right? And if you knew the adoption cycle, that's kind of what happens, the hype cycle. And I think in 2024, some of the hype around AI is going to recede where people are going to start seeing the value of AI, where AI, um, does, does work and that is in accelerating the things.

Kofi: The strength of what you already have and what you've already built internally and the relationships that you already have is not going to replace that is not going to pull it out of thin air. I [00:37:00] has to work from some something and you have and that's something requires humans to figure it out.

Mehmet: Absolutely. And, uh, you know, this. You know this term we brought it also on the show with the guests that I interviewed on many occasions especially when you said Junk in junk out. So If you feed ai with junk, it will give you junk. This is the you know well known fact uh problem, I think it's human behavior coffee because Let's be honest with ourselves.

Mehmet: So We are lazy by nature, right? So we like to find shortcuts and I think AI gave everybody, because everyone can have access to these AI tools, gave us access to generate content, to generate graphics, not, yeah, the example of Google, you know, Uh, what's happening with them and, you know, now generating videos.

Mehmet: But again, to your point, the [00:38:00] human touch is always key there because, and you know, I shared also something, um, two weeks by now, by the time this goes out to be like almost one month, you know, I said something and I shared on LinkedIn, I said like no time before. The storytelling became something very crucial for especially startups, because if you cannot tell your story and because, you know, you will use AI, of course, but if you don't mention, you know, the story in a way which can Capture your audience.

Mehmet: The AI will not be able to do that for you because the AI uses what information is available to it, right? So, um, this becomes like really key there. Um, but are you seeing coffee like now? Let me reverse this question and it's not, it's like maybe kind [00:39:00] of contradictory question to what I just asked you.

Mehmet: Someone might argue, okay, because these big guys, they have the access, they have the budget, they're gonna leverage AI and actually they're gonna go and crush every single startup that will try to appear. Do you have concerns about that? And if so, as a Small business owner or an entrepreneur. How should I protect myself from, as we call them, the tech giants?

Kofi: Yeah, there's, so if you're talking about, um, IP, intellectual property and kind of from a product perspective, I think a lot of your, your, you know, that's, that's important. That's a different conversation that I think, um, you know, people, the kind of lawyers and such kind of credit, uh, could probably, um, help with, but when, if you're talking about from market share and, um, brand awareness and, you know, adopting cost customers, what I will say is that, [00:40:00] um, the reverse is actually true, um, in my experience, audience, um, customer basis, markets, audiences, people.

Kofi: Are becoming more and more, um, people want a lot more connections with things that are not a great faceless behemoth, right? Um, there are more nuances to human behavior and cultural, um, different cultures and different locales than I would argue that Google, Microsoft, Amazon could ever capture in with any amount of money.

Kofi: And you can see a lot of that, Mehmet, you're, you're, you're in Dubai. As you look international, you'll see that a lot of the, the, the large companies with the endless budget that we see in the U S especially that we take for granted, they don't have the impact in other markets, um, that they have in the, in the U S.

Kofi: And that's an example of the fact that there is essentially [00:41:00] enough to go around from a, from a market share perspective, if you're talking to the right person, um, and. People's behaviors and expectations are changing really rap rapidly. And you, you look at the different generations, the specific environmental effects, if you start diving into the nuances of what we, what the audience is, whether it be an audience, um, uh, a customer base in Singapore, um, that's in the outskirts of the city, or, you know, someone somewhere in Ghana that is in Accra, you know, like you can slice it so many different ways.

Kofi: And each one of these audiences have nuances that I, in my opinion, any company will have, will have to be choiceful about, uh, about servicing. So that's an opportunity for startups and scale ups, right? A lot of startups and scale ups start with, you know, I want to go for a broad market with, you know, they start from a [00:42:00] products perspective.

Kofi: So. I'll take a, uh, accounting software or even textiles, right? You know, I want a beats B2B audience that, uh, fashion designers that in the case of one of my clients, fashion designers in the U S that wants to source, uh, uh, fabric and textiles for their clothing lines. Super broad. I mean, that's so many different people, right?

Kofi: But when you start diving into the nuances of those audiences and those customer bases, you start seeing that there's a difference between an indie designer and a global, you know, a Prada or Gucci, which I've worked with as well. Right. Their processes, what they're trying to do X, Y, and Z. So that's, that's different.

Kofi: You even have some of the. The, the up and coming, you know, kind of streetwear brands, for instance, that have a lot of money, have a lot of investments. And again, so there are nuances there that a startup can carve out for themselves. And really, um, it's usually an unserved market because those big companies are going broad.

Kofi: There's an unserved market, an untapped market within those, [00:43:00] those, um, uh, within those sub markets, there's an untapped sub market within those markets that can be a great foothold. If a startup is able to, um, uh, reach those, those Customers and build relationships with them. They're more likely again, with some of the, the, the, the tools that we would be able to give those audiences as far as branding the stories and how do you, you know, customer experience and the data they then become the majority within because again, A lot of those audiences become the majority audience over time.

Kofi: So being small and yes, Google is going to look for everyone, right? But the value of a startup and where startup really needs to um has a competitive advantage is being to be laser focused on that one audience nurturing them and And then also allowing them to exp, to expand and grow and tell their people.

Kofi: And the startup obviously grows with them. So it's, it's actually, [00:44:00] it's actually a good thing. Let Google go for everybody in the world. I mean, they, they, they prepared, they, they, they, they see the market for a lot of us anyway, but they can't serve the market. So they see the market. But they can't serve the market.

Kofi: So by the time we come in and we have a product that, that meets needs and it's more customized, a tech startup, we'll be able to accelerate. 

Mehmet: Absolutely. Coffee. And actually you, this time you hit the nail on the head by when you mentioned relationship, um, because this is. Part of, again, you gave the example of Amazon like a few minutes back and about, you know, how the customer, you know, care, uh, experience that they gave you, you know, it, it was there.

Mehmet: So this relationship, I think this is the underrated part. And this is where the startups and scale ups they should focus on, like always make your customer happy. And let them [00:45:00] feel that really you care about them. It's not like just, you know, a banner behind your office or it's something on your website.

Mehmet: Hey, we love our customers. Okay. Yeah. Everyone says that, right? So how, how really you love your customers and you care about them? And this is the, Personal touch plus relationship. So absolutely coffee. Now, as we're almost coming to an end, it's a very fast changing world today, coffee. And if you want to leave the audience today with a piece of advice, whether they are entrepreneurs or they are into the marketing, uh, game, so how, you know, what kind of advice you would give them with as final words from you?

Kofi: Yeah, I would say that you have a competitive advantage already. It's hidden in your business. It's probably not your product. Um, so you have a competitive [00:46:00] advantage. It's the people is the process. It is experiences of the people that you're bringing into your, your company is the, why you leverage that leverage that understand that.

Kofi: Based on who you've interacted with. If you don't understand it, talk to some of the people who've supported you. Currently record that conversation and AI will help you transcribe that and give you the insight. So again, using AI where, where necessary, have those conversations, record conversations, understand what makes you unique, tell a story, craft a story about that, right?

Kofi: What is that story that someone else could to, that you could tell someone else and they could tell other people build the experience. And then see the impact, always be measuring. I know I don't have to tell too many of the start ups the skills, skills about it, but always be measuring, always be measuring the right things.

Kofi: And ultimately that's what I've seen with a lot of the companies that I've worked with as what, um, where success is a [00:47:00] product you're going to have. I assume that your product is going to be good. It is great. It is going to be wonderful. And I think that there's a need for it, but if you want to make a mark, if you want to make an impact with the people that you, that you want to reach, then it is about those values, those stories, those experiences and the impact.

Kofi: And you have to kind of focus on those three things to accelerate your brand. 

Mehmet: Absolutely. I love this especially, you know, the values These are something very important Uh cover your last thing where people can find out about you and get in touch with you if they want to Work with you 

Kofi: Yes, remember that.

Kofi: Yeah. Thanks for the chat. I've really enjoyed you having me. It's been a wonderful conversation. I'm glad I was able to share some of this and hopefully your listeners are able to have enjoyed this chat as well. And, you know, so I put, I'm put together a, uh, some resources that listeners could use free resources, um, access to me and [00:48:00] my team for, um, a free, uh, consults, um, if you want, and they could go to the brand sensei.

Kofi: co. Forward slash CTO. So that's the brand sensei dot C O forward slash CTO. And that's a, uh, resource page that I give to your listeners and they could go there and they'll have access to me. They'll have access to my team and they also have some free resources there, like, uh, um, AI readiness tools. So helps you, we have a.

Kofi: Um, tool that helps you, uh, understand the role AI can play in your brand marketing without you getting overwhelmed. And like you said, putting, putting, um, garbage out into the world. So, you know, I'm thinking strategically, so it's going to be at the brand sensei. co forward slash CTO. 

Mehmet: Absolutely. I will make sure that, uh, the link is in the show notes so people can reach it, uh, easily, I would say.

Mehmet: And again, thank you for your coffee, actually, because, um, you [00:49:00] know, you shed the light on many things, which I believe, and this is part of what I'm trying to do, although the show name is CTO Show, and I'm insisting not to change the name, because I believe, Technology and technologists, I would say, technology leaders, startup founders, they need to learn about, uh, you know, marketing, branding, uh, sales.

Mehmet: And this is why sometimes, you know, I blend, you know, my, my podcast episodes with, you know, people experienced like yourself, coffee to come and tell us about this and why this is important, because, you know, Hopefully, and this is my hope, someone, and I'm sure there will be someone benefiting out of You know what we discussed today so they can actually have a successful business because at the end of the day, you need to do multiple things to have a successful business.

Mehmet: So thank you again, Kofi, for [00:50:00] sharing this, uh, this insight, these insights with, uh, with us today. And I really enjoyed it. So, and this is how usually I end my episodes and this is for the audience. If you just by luck, You did we're searching something and then you found this podcast. Thank you for Giving us a listen.

Mehmet: I hope you enjoyed if you did, please subscribe And share it with your friends and colleagues We are available on all the podcasting platforms. We're available also on youtube And if you are one of the loyal followers who keep coming keep coming and keep listening to us. Thank you very much Keep sending your feedbacks, keep sending me your emails and your messages on social media.

Mehmet: I love, I love to read them, all of them. And also if you are interested to be on the show, you have a story you want to tell us. If you are doing something special, you think there is a topic related to what I'm doing, but I didn't cover [00:51:00] it yet. Please don't hesitate to reach out. I would love to have a discussion and see If there's a possibility to record the episode together and that's it for all for today Thank you for tuning in.

Mehmet: We'll meet again very soon. Thank you. Bye. Bye. 

Kofi: Thank you. Bye