#316 Startup Storytelling: Danielle R. Harris on Creating Connections and Impact

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Mehmet: Hello and welcome back to a new episode of the CTO show with Mehmet. Today, I'm very pleased joining me, Daniellele Harris. Daniel, thank you very much for being with me on the show. The way I love to do it, as I was explaining to you before, I keep it to my guests [00:01:00] to introduce themselves. Tell us a little bit about you, what you do, and then we can take the conversation from there.

Danielle: Yeah, I'm happy to be here. Happy to introduce myself. I'm Danielle R. Harris. I'm a marketing and messaging consultant, and I've been in the marketing industry for well over a decade at this point. And I've done everything from Uh, huge corporate organizations to helping entrepreneurs, helping them to really get clear on the story that they're going to be telling in their marketing.

Danielle: And I just truly believe that the story that you tell is going to make your marketing much more efficient for a lot of times people think that, well, like, I don't have an interesting story. I just want to focus and lean on, you know, what it is that I can do, the results that I can drive, but having a story, having a narrative is what's going to get people to be very much on board and believe in and want to buy whatever it is that you're selling, whether it's a service, a product, whatever it is, having a great story behind that is really [00:02:00] what's going to make it friendly for the market.

Danielle: And so I pride myself on helping my clients coming up. with the best story that's going to put their positioning together so that people want to go and buy from them. So I've been doing this for a while now. I started my career, uh, talking about and creating stories for a highly technical organization, uh, where people are just like, I don't know how you can make that sound interesting and have a great story behind that, all the way to personal brands who really Really want to position themselves as an expert within their industry.

Danielle: So I've run the gambit and I'm so happy to, to be here and talk with everyone today about, you know, marketing and their story and how they can leverage that to really grow their business. 

Mehmet: Thank you very much, Daniella, again, for being with me today. Now, some people say. Asks me, you know, it's called the CTO show.

Mehmet: And sometimes, uh, people knows by now, uh, I like to cover non technical topics as well. So, you know, of [00:03:00] course, majority of the time we have thought leaders from, they are tech leaders themselves, tech startup founders. Um, but I have a belief, you know, that. Topics such as sales, marketing are very important, especially in the early stages.

Mehmet: Right. So, um, now you mentioned, you know, like something which is, uh, important about, you know, the, the, the storytelling, right. Um, so In the, you know, field of tech and startup, you know, uh, point of view, can you, you know, explain to us why storytelling is so crucial as part of the marketing strategy? Why it's very important to highlight this Storytelling in, in, in their, you know, aim because probably they are not only talking also to [00:04:00] customers.

Mehmet: Probably they will be talking also to investors. So shed some light to us on that topic. 

Danielle: Yeah. I remember talking to a client of mine and they were prepping for a pitch competition and it was in front of a board, a lineup of Very prominent, uh, people within their area where they could potentially, of course, get feedback and then funding eventually for whatever it is that they, that they were doing.

Danielle: And one of the top things that was the feedback that my, or the other people, not my client, the other people were given was that I need to understand why I should care about that. My client was actually the only person that didn't get that feedback and was regularly. Reference back to like you need to be like her as you're pitching, but really it's more about why should I care about this?

Danielle: Yes, like it sounds like it's cool. It does these other things but like why [00:05:00] should the people at large care about this? What's unique about your story and your background that makes you uniquely positioned? to be a leader within this space. And there is a lot of different things. Like, yes, you need to know your numbers.

Danielle: You need to know about your market penetration. You need to know about all these other things. But also, if you're trying to release something that's going to go out to the general public as a whole, they need to understand what it is that they're getting on board with, what it is that they're buying.

Danielle: And storytelling is one of the top ways that people remember. You need to have something that people are going to say like, Oh, I recognize that this is a problem that I have. And this is the story that they're telling. That's telling me that they can help with the thing that I'm struggling with. If you don't have that type of story that latches on people's attention.

Danielle: Talks about why their life is going to be better because of this thing that you have. They're not going to be on board. No one's going to want to invest. No one's going to want to buy because they're not going to understand what's happening. Storytelling is the best way to [00:06:00] get people on board with what it is that you're trying to do and trying to sell.

Mehmet: That's awesome. I would say, Daniel, and, uh, Now for people who might be first time founders, right? So they never have done this before. Of course, you know, probably they might hear us today on this podcast and, you know, they decide to go and start, or maybe they're going to go and find, uh, maybe a YouTube video and try to see how others have done it.

Mehmet: Now, how important is also to keep authenticity when, when, when building this story, then you're like, um, and what are like maybe some other challenges that they need to, to, uh, to, uh, you know, overcome. Uh, because I know it's not easy to, to draft this story. So usually from your experience, like first how to keep the authenticity second, you know, What are the challenges [00:07:00] and how they can overcome that?

Danielle: Yeah, I know. I know a lot of times people are thinking like, okay, well, I don't have anything that's really cool. And so I could kind of stretch this a little bit and talk about that. And I guess it's kind of, I think people might be more on board if I talk about this. That's not, that's not what you want to do.

Danielle: The more that you're going to say that these are the actual timelines, these are the actual experiences that I've had, the better. You talked about authenticity. You have to be honest about what it is that you did. If you don't have that experience and background and XYZ thing that you're trying to sell, but maybe you saw someone else struggling with that, don't try to co opt their story and place it as your own.

Danielle: Just say that you were inspired. by something like I want you to be perfectly honest with everything. But as far as how you're going to go about crafting and developing it, it literally takes practice. You have to put in the hours of saying over and over again, hitting your points without stuttering over anything so that you can say it [00:08:00] clearly and succinctly.

Danielle: And no, I talk about this a lot. When people go to present at TED or TEDx, one of the things they tell the speakers to do is to practice their speech over and over and over again. And that's the same thing with creating your story and then selling your story. It's going to be about you crafting it, it's getting the feedback on it, it's doing it again.

Danielle: It's You're gonna have a beta test of it. You're gonna have a, you know, your primary rounds of as you're getting it down and refining it the same amount of time that you're developing on getting your product right is the same amount of intentionality that you need to have behind telling your story because that's going to be at the forefront as you're trying to, you know, Get whatever it is that you have out to market.

Danielle: It's that story, it's that origin piece that is really going to help you launch it. Yes, even if it has the most technical back and it's beautiful, it has all these things. But if it's not a compelling story that people want to get on [00:09:00] board with, then it's probably not going to go anywhere. And so it's this piece of being practice is making sure that you can tell this story clearly and that you're hitting all of the right notes.

Danielle: That's going to make sure that. You're going to tell a story that's going to get you where you need to go. 

Mehmet: Absolutely. Now, also, something that, uh, people might think about is, okay, I have crafted a story, I have practiced it, right? Now, when it comes and, you know, they, they started to talk to some people.

Mehmet: Now, do you think with time, they need to establish kind of also, Personal brand to power, you know, this, this story, how important is, is to, to also like, uh, I would say boost this, uh, storytelling with kind of a thought leadership slash, you know, online presence. How, how do you [00:10:00] advise Julie, your, your, uh, clients to do, uh, Dan?

Danielle: Having a personal brand in addition to the business that you're running and the brand profile of that is going to be extremely important. And I know that a lot of people are just like, I'm, that's overwhelming. I'm really trying to just be in the presence of what it is that I'm launching right now. I'm trying to launch this business.

Danielle: I'm trying to get it in front of all of these people so that I can get the funding so that I can, No, get everything up and running together. I don't have time to then say like, Oh, I had to do a photo shoot and I have to go this. I have to do that. But I want to say that that's probably going to be one of your best key assets and actually growing the profile of the business that you have, because depending on where it goes, like you don't, you want to make sure that you are taking advantage of the fact that you are a person that's selling this thing.

Danielle: A lot of times you see like, okay, here's a big company. Here's a big name there. And, uh, You're just like, okay, well then I was a, I was a part of that. [00:11:00] You as your own brand, you as your own story, like that's going to be one of the big things. A lot of times people say, Hey, like, here are all the things that you, this company has done, but I want to hear about you.

Danielle: Why is it that you did this? And you having your own unique perspective is going to only enhance the company as a whole that you're trying to build. So. When I say that, like, what are your thoughts and opinions as to why you decided to, to have this, what are some of the things that you believe are your, your ethics that go into how you're creating this and having all of those things lined up and talking about on a regular basis, as you're going out and meeting other people, you're thinking like, oh, I'm representing, you know, my, my company, but also you're representing yourself and people are going to.

Danielle: associate you with the company that you're trying to build. And the more that you're able to be searchable, uh, the more that you're able to be visible, people can then connect the two, but then also say like, okay, well, but they are also knowledgeable in this other area. [00:12:00] And you can leverage your own personal brand to get other opportunities that are not necessarily solely focused 100 percent on your company, but also Based off of your own expertise and your own background.

Danielle: So that was a long roundabout way of saying like, yes, it's incredibly, incredibly important to have your own personal brand because it's going to help you as you're growing and marketing your business. Then also, it's just great for you as your own self. You might decide that you want to then go and and sell your business.

Danielle: Someone else is super successful. And you're just like, I want to sell this. I want to have something else. Once you have a brand that's been built up your own personal brain that's built up, then you have this capital that you have acquired for yourself. You're not saying like, oh, yeah, well, I was the former whatever, but then like, no one else knows me or anything.

Danielle: I didn't do anything with the time that I had to build up my profile. If you're simultaneously doing those two things, having this notoriety, And it's not notoriety for the sake of notoriety, but for you're establishing yourself as an expert, as [00:13:00] someone that's a go to person. That's something that you can always take with you wherever it is that you go.

Mehmet: Now, something just came to my mind before I asked you the next question. Um, especially people with tech backgrounds, you know, when they become co founders. Um, we, we, we discussed it with a lot of, of, uh, the guests here on the show. They think that they are introverts and they might have some self doubt of, okay, I know my story, I know my vision, I know all these, but I might struggle communicating this to my audience, right?

Mehmet: So are there any, I would say, Um, you know, magic pills, or I mean, any, any, any spells that they might, of course I'm saying this in a metaphor way, but I mean, of course you mentioned that, you know, when they go to [00:14:00] TEDx, they have to practice, but I mean, does this something that you see that can really affect if they have this communication fear and how they can fix that, Daniel?

Danielle: Well, I would honestly say that I'm an introvert as well. So I do get that if I don't have to do a whole bunch of stuff. And I'm just like, uh, I'm good sitting back, letting other people that seem to thrive off of being in front of the audience and doing all these things. Have it. Go and have it. But, at the same time, there, there's a couple things that are going on.

Danielle: One is the thought that you are bad at it a lot of times. And I, I don't think that anybody is necessarily better, or, let me put it this way. I don't think that it's not something that people can't overcome. I think that there are people that are either, They call themselves socially awkward. There are people that call themselves introverts.

Danielle: There are people that saw themselves like, [00:15:00] I'm just not good in these types of situations, but I think that there's always a chance and always an opportunity for someone to go forth and say like, well, but in these types of situations, this is where I thrive. And so for some people, it might be like, I'm not going to those huge networking events where there's thousands and thousands of people, because I'm just gonna, I'm just gonna stand in the corner and Nope, it's not.

Danielle: I'm not going to meet anybody. It would be a waste of my time, so I'm not going to throw out that way. I say that you find the way that's going to be the most, the least hurdle for you to try to get your profile out there. For some people, it's just like, if I could just write something and build up my reputation that way, I'll do that.

Danielle: Some people are just like, Oh, yeah, well, if I can just like talk into a microphone and create a podcast, I don't have to necessarily see a whole bunch of other people. And that's my way of doing this. If other people love speaking on stages, there's just like, I don't want to like talk to people. It's like one on one, but if I can just like talk in front of.

Danielle: A whole [00:16:00] group of people at once and get it done and then get off the stage, I can do that. I'll have to say that there are multiple ways for you to raise your profile in a way that feels the most comfortable to you. If your version is just sitting behind a screen and just like, here are my thoughts on this, and you're on Medium or wherever else, on LinkedIn, and like, you just put your thoughts out there that way.

Danielle: Like, that's a perfectly great introvert way of putting your thought leadership out there. I don't think there's only one version of how you can do that. I don't think that you necessarily have to be the most socialist, social butterfly ist person out there being at all of the in person events and shaking hands with thousands of people.

Danielle: I think there are multiple ways to build up your brand and authority, but it doesn't necessarily require you being like, I'm the most introvert type of person. But to say that like, oh, that's just something that I don't do, I think is something that you're doing a disservice to yourself by not at least attempting to do that.

Danielle: Because you have a lot to say, people are going to be very interested in what it [00:17:00] is that you have to say. And because of your introverted nature, you're probably observing things that a lot of other people are missing, which is why it's needed even more so. So all that to say, find a way that's going to feel the most.

Danielle: Interesting to you, most accessible to you, whether it is going to a networking event and meeting a whole bunch of people or just building up an online community that people want to follow and read what it is that you're doing. 

Mehmet: Absolutely. Now, I noticed something when I was preparing for the episode that I'd like to go over the point.

Mehmet: Profile of my guests. And I've noticed something which might be very beneficial for, you know, the discussion today. So you've worked also on some international projects, right? So, now when we talk messaging, we talk story, we talk all these, and if you are, you know, whether we accept it or not, we're living in a very small world because of the internet and, everyone is connected.

Mehmet: So how important [00:18:00] also is To put into consideration when you have this story for the startup to take into consideration the nuances that, you know, might be present because of cultural differences. Uh, although, and by the way, you know, majority of the time we cover B2B space and tech, as I said, even B2C, but in tech.

Mehmet: So you need to take into consideration when, when you come up with a message or a story that you don't. be aggressive to someone, right? So how important is, you know, is this in, in, in creating this, I would say story slash vision slash personal branding. 

Danielle: Yeah. The most important thing that I always tell people is to think about who it is that you're trying to serve.

Danielle: Uh, we've been talking about story a lot, putting your story out there, establishing yourself, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. But the goal of the story isn't just to hype yourself up, it's to connect with the [00:19:00] people that you are, you know, wanting to be in a relationship with. And it's really to show a possibility of what things can be like and in order to do that you need to be very clear on who it is that you're trying to talk to.

Danielle: Because if you're determining that, like, there are like three distinct different groups that I'm trying to talk to as I tell the story, I need to make sure that I'm telling a story that these three different groups are going to be able to receive, that they're going to have great feelings about this.

Danielle: They're not going to feel like you said, it's going to be overly aggressive. It's not going to rub people the wrong way. It's you have to be very clear on who it is that you're trying to describe. serve, who it is that you're trying to talk to when you're telling these stories, and how they will receive that.

Danielle: If you don't do that, then it's going to be very easy to say something that's wrong. It's going to be very easy for you to offend people. It's going to be very easy for you to rub someone the wrong way because of what it is that you said. So you have to be so clear on that. On who it is that you're talking to, and it could be that, like, oh, here's a [00:20:00] demographic that lives in in this region versus that region.

Danielle: But then also you need to think about, oh, okay, but there are this type of consumer, maybe they're a VC, or maybe it's a consumer base, or maybe it's like, these are the things you need to take into consideration as you tell your story. And. I believe that you just don't have one story that you tell. You have like a core story, but then you have variations of that depending on who it is that you're talking to.

Danielle: It's all grounded and rooted in the same thing, but how you would explain a situation to, say, a three year old is probably going to be different than how you explain a situation to a 16 year old. And so in that same way of, No, there might be you told the same thing, but there are details and nuances that a 30 year old just won't understand the same thing when you're talking to a consumer, they may not understand a lot of the jargon.

Danielle: So you talk about the same thing in one way versus another group in another way, or another group in one region is the same core story, but you know that these different notes [00:21:00] are going to resonate with them versus someone that lives in somewhere else. It is all true. It is all the same story, but being able to.

Danielle: To say like, okay, but this is going to resonate more with this these people over here knowing that it's going to be so important But it takes knowing who it is that you're talking to 

Mehmet: now I sometimes do this also as well. Like I believe there are some methods, you know a myth that need to be busted as they say so Some because i've heard it from some people daniel So especially in the tech because we're discussing here like mainly tech stuff.

Mehmet: They say You You know my product or service, you know, it's very techie and actually, you know I need to do a lot of these jargons because I cannot get a story out of it I get them, but I still believe and I want to take your opinion. You can agree or disagree with me I I think that [00:22:00] even the most sophisticated tech the most sophisticated If they are at the end of the day solving a pain You They can create story out of that.

Mehmet: Do you agree? And if so, why? And if not, also why? And if you have an example that you can share with us. 

Danielle: Yeah, I definitely believe that if, if you know what it is that you're talking about, you should be able to create a story based off of it without using jargon and in a way that's going to be easy for the general public to understand.

Danielle: I think that if you're not able to do that, that a couple of things, either you don't know it well enough to break it down or Yeah, I mean, I don't, I don't want to offend anybody, but like, do you know how to talk about things to other people that are outside, outside of your area? Because if you aren't talking to [00:23:00] people outside of the area about what it is that you do, and you're not able to explain this, how well can you explain this to anyone?

Danielle: That's even like a smidge outside of what it is that you do in a way that's going to be intelligible. Like it's, that's honestly like a shortcoming that's going to probably hinder you in some way, shape, or form if you're not able to do that. And I would suggest highly that you go talk and work with someone that's able to, to do this.

Danielle: My background, No, for years of my career, I was working in the concrete construction industry. So working with a lot of people that were PhDs and civil engineering, and they were talking about very highly technical concrete designs and methodologies and things like that. And I worked on the marketing team helping to take this highly technical information and make it sound as if it was like, Oh yeah, like everybody can understand what's going on.

Danielle: I, I always use the example of I needed to make [00:24:00] these highly technical conferences, all of the different papers that they were going to be talking about, all the different workshops and seminars about these highly technical things and make it sound as if like, Oh yeah, like a high school student can understand what it is.

Danielle: they were talking about. And being able to do that is a true skill because it's not just for the people that are attending it to be able to understand it now, but it's for anybody else. And I always use the example of the people that are looking at these, these descriptions, people that are looking at these things aren't just necessarily your target audience, but it could be someone that's in accounting that's approving something.

Danielle: And if they're just like, what is this? I don't understand what's happening is going on. Are they going to want to approve this? Are they going to approve attending this workshop on like what exactly is it per se? And so I'm, I'm just saying that it's a, it's a true skill to be able to do that. If you're not able to, I challenge you to sit down for like a half hour and try to figure out a way to do that because that's probably going to be a stumbling block.

Danielle: Maybe not today, [00:25:00] but down the line, if you are not able to talk about, What it is that you do in terms that aren't jargon or at least be able to explain what the jargon is so that your grandmother could understand it, then, like, if you're not able to do that, I don't, I don't understand how you're going to be able to go very far.

Mehmet: Absolutely. Now we've talked about storytelling. We've talked about, uh, kind of personal branding also as well, or the thought leadership. Okay. Um, what other. I would say methods or things from marketing perspective Tech startup founders they need to think about to Get some traction, especially in the early days, of course, you know Usually we advise founders to go and start to talk to the customers and, you know, when they, especially if they are in the early stages.

Mehmet: So when we say customers or prospects to be more accurate. So we talked about people that they [00:26:00] have direct relationship, but at some stage they need to start, you know, to talk to more, uh, big audience. So from your experience, Daniel, what are other Uh, strategies they can implement in the early stage without breaking The the budget to start getting some traction.

Danielle: Yeah, so Again, it's going to take knowing who it is exactly that you're trying to target with your efforts are Based off of whatever it is that you're doing. Do you need if you're helping students with tutoring type of thing? Like do you need to start showing up at? Student focus conferences or teacher conventions or things of that nature to get in front of more people.

Danielle: And so it's just like, all right, I'm going to have a booth or maybe I can't afford to have a booth. So I'm going to sign up to be an attendee at this conference, and I'm going to go and talk to a bunch of teachers, or I'm going to then. Go and I'm going to talk to [00:27:00] parents at some type of event so that I can get in front of more people and network and start talking to people that way.

Danielle: Or maybe you're just like, okay, I've done all of those types of things, but I still need to be something on a bigger stage. Something like having a YouTube channel where you're putting out resources and then starting to promote that as you go out to all these different other places. It's really going to be about you finding more people that are further outside.

Danielle: So I'm going to talk a little bit more about that in a second, but first, I'm going to talk a little bit more about how you can go outside of your direct circle of influence. There are a lot of times you're just like, all right, I topped all the people that are just like a friend of a friend. But like I said, you're trying to go at scale at mass and you're going to have to put yourself in positions where you can do that and create things where it can constantly go through through and without you necessarily being there, have an audience.

Danielle: So having a YouTube channel or a podcast is going to be a really good way of putting information out there and seeing what the attraction is. You're going to, of course, have to promote that and put that out there, but it does a couple of things that if you have a [00:28:00] podcast and you know, you as the founder or the host of it, it's doing a few things as raising your own personal Brand.

Danielle: It's also positioning your business as a whole. And as you're talking about different topics that you've heard about from other people, as you've talked to them, it's being able to address some of those frequently asked questions is able to then go through and explain some of the concepts that you have, um, really a long form, um, A long form piece of marketing that you're able to put together is going to be so helpful.

Danielle: So YouTube, podcast, a blog, because blogs aren't dead and it's good from a CEO standpoint. Like those are going to be some good ways to make sure that you're, you're constantly putting things out there, but that doesn't negate like the, the need for you to actually have you or people on your team going to places, getting in front of people, and then you using that as information as you go back through and decide like, okay, these are the things that we need to be talking about.

Mehmet: That's fantastic. And you know, I can't agree more with, you know, [00:29:00] all what you mentioned, but especially, uh, you know, going to conferences that are relevant to them and try to show up there, talk, talk to people in these conferences. This is very, very helpful. Now it's very obvious that, you know, this is. I would say because we're living in a complex world and somehow like it's, there are a lot of noise.

Mehmet: There's a lot of things that we need to try. And of course, especially in the startup phase, they need to be trying to your point, multiple things. Now, of course we need to keep doing what is working and maybe we need to drop what is not. Now, from a professional perspective, how do you say, or how do you judge, okay, this marketing strategy, it's working fine.

Mehmet: And this is not. We should drop this. What are, like, as we call them, the KPIs, the key indicators that, yes, this [00:30:00] strategy is giving us results while this is not. How, how do you leverage, you know, the data also to take decisions and advise, you know, your, your clients to, to continue in a path or drop another one?

Danielle: Yeah, so I think that. There are metrics that you look at for short term and then things that you look at for long term. So say you went to a conference and you've gotten X amount of leads and some of those people turned into either investors or people that are now using the process, uh, the product that you have, that's going to be like, okay, that I had a positive ROI because you're ready to find what it is that you want it.

Danielle: You want it to know about clients. You want it to know, have a, Have possibilities of networking all these different things like you need to go in there ahead of time and have all those things together now at the same time things like a podcast or a blog, those are going to have a longer term possible return, and it might take maybe like a [00:31:00] year or so before something happens.

Danielle: So I think you have to be able to think about, okay. What are the things that I need a result on in the short term versus the things that are just like, I am going to be willing to do this for a year and a half before I'm really able to tell if this is working or not. I think a lot of times people are going to be really quick to say, like, okay, well, I've been doing this for, you know, 2 months and this doesn't seem to be working or doing anything and then give up.

Danielle: I think you have to really evaluate are the things that I'm doing and looking at are they short term things or are they long term things that we're looking at? And so. Going to a networking event, going to a fair, going to being a speaker at a particular thing, those can have a lot of short term KPIs and you can look at it and say, like, okay, yep, this was a worthwhile thing to be at.

Danielle: I want to go at this or something like this again and other things. You're just like, okay, it's. Been, you know, a year and a half. We've been super consistent and posting and showing up on this. [00:32:00] We're not seeing the needle move on leads coming in passively. We're not seeing this. We're not seeing that. Okay.

Danielle: We've put in a good faith effort on this and then we can switch and pivot, but I think it's knowing the difference between what it is that you need to know, like right now and like what are going to be like immediate indicators and what are going to be things that is going to take, it's going to take a while.

Danielle: Before some of these things bear fruit. And so, once you know the difference between those things, then you can determine, like, okay, what's the time horizon on knowing if this is a worthwhile thing. So, I don't think it's necessarily, like, as cut and dry, but also it can be. Of just saying, like, alright, we want to get X amount of, uh, you know, followers on whatever thing.

Danielle: Are you able to do that? But then it's like, how are we going to then convert them into leads? What are all the things that you're going to be trying? Do you have persons that are dedicated to working towards doing that? Versus like, we put some stuff up there and like, it's not doing anything and then it isn't working.

Danielle: It's like, well, are you like really working it? Or like, what, what are the [00:33:00] things that you're that you're actually trying to do to make sure that it's a thing that could potentially grow. It could be that like, nope, we tried all the things. We changed doing our hooks of how we started our videos. We made sure that we changed up how all these different graphics appear.

Danielle: We did this, we did that. It's not working. Okay, now we can move on to something else versus like, we tried some stuff, we put some stuff out there and nothing happens. Like, well, it wasn't going to happen because of you weren't putting like a good amount of effort into it. But it's, I really think that's.

Danielle: Looking at things from a short and long term perspective is really going to be how you can judge the KPIs. 

Mehmet: Absolutely, and you know, I think in the startup phase they are lucky because they can be agile. Uh trying different things they can, you know, apply a b testing they can do different things over there But yeah to your point they need to understand their Strategy on the short and and long term absolutely Um daniel as we almost come to an end and this is something I ask my [00:34:00] guests always two things So final thoughts from your side And where people can find more about you and get in touch.

Danielle: Yeah, so I just want to say as we wrap up everything, making sure that you're so aligned with who it is that you're trying to help, and making sure that the stories that you're telling are going to be really captivating, that's something that's, that's going to be so key to what it is that you're doing.

Danielle: And if you ever have opportunities to get in front of a, A very group of people to get feedback on what those stories are and how they've resonated and connected with, that's going to be the biggest thing that you can, you could possibly do. And that's one of the things that I really help my clients with when I work with them one on one is developing and cracking that story and getting that feedback and refining it so that it's going to be the most impactful that it can be.

Danielle: And so if you want to learn more about storytelling and how you can use In your own marketing for your startup, uh, for your business. Then you can definitely follow me [00:35:00] on instagram at danielle. r. harris, on linkedin danielle. r. harris And you can also listen to me on my podcast marketing network. 

Mehmet: Thank you very much danielle I really appreciate you know the time and the insight that you gave us today I will make sure all the links you provided they will be present in the show notes so people they don't need to To struggle to find that And again, uh, it was a very enlightening, uh, episode again, I would say I have a theory that, you know, bringing people like you then into the show at a lot, because we're trying to have this complete holistic view of, of a startup, not only from tech perspective, but from sales, marketing, PR, you just name it, right?

Mehmet: So that, because, you know, a startup is not just, The products not only the service. It's like a combination of all these things around it So thank you very much for being here today. And this is how usually [00:36:00] I add my episodes This is for the audience if you just discovered this podcast by luck. Thank you for passing by.

Mehmet: I hope you enjoyed Please if you did Subscribe tell your friends and colleagues about it And if you are one of the followers and the loyal followers that keep coming, thank you very much for your encouragement Thank you very much for all your support. Thank you for your messages and notes and suggestions.

Mehmet: I read them all Thank you very much for all this and Stay tuned for new episodes as usual We broadcast this on Monday, Wednesday, Friday, uh, morning US time. And if you are interested of being on the show, don't hesitate to reach out to me directly. We can arrange a time for recording. Thank you very much for tuning in.

Mehmet: We will meet again very soon. Thank you. Bye bye.