#329 Fractional Executives Explained by Sue Mysko: A New Era in Business Strategy

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Mehmet: Hello and welcome back to a new episode of the CTO Show with Mehmet today. I'm very pleased joining me, Sue. Sue, thank you very much for joining me. The way I love to do it is to make it like more, um, authentic. I like my guests to introduce [00:01:00] themselves, tell us a little bit about you, what you are currently doing, and then we can start the conversation from there.

Mehmet: So the floor is yours.

Sue: Awesome. Am Thank you so much. And so it's so great to be here. So my name's Sue Mysko. I am a fractional CMO, and I'm the founder of Hire Fractional. I have spent 25 years in professional services marketing, and it was a few years back where I decided to become a fractional CMO, I quickly realized that there was a huge gap in the market between the number of fractional, you know, fractional CIOs, CTOs, CMOs across the board, were looking to find roles and they were looking for companies.

Sue: And on the flip side, the companies were desperate to find the fractionals. And so. That was born of Hire fractional we've been we launched back in november And yeah, it's been a super exciting journey so far

Mehmet: That's a great To hear sue and thank you again [00:02:00] for being here on the show today. So, you know Let's start from defining You know, what means a fractional talent, whatever it is, like, is it a fractional CMO, fractional CTO?

Mehmet: And now we are seeing it like this more and more. So, If you can explain to us what a fractional talent in general means For those who might not be familiar with the concept

Sue: exactly. So a fractional executive is somebody who Embodies three things. First of all, they sit in the c suite. They provide leadership to the c suite executive So that is Uh, both up into the C suite as well as to the team that they're leading, regardless of the function that they're in.

Sue: They provide strategy. They're responsible for building the strategy and that go to market strategy, regardless, again, regardless of function. And lastly, they're on point for results. They are the person [00:03:00] who is, like I said, part of that C suite, so they are embedded in the organization. And so, a fractional executive can be across, uh, All the C suite functions, CTO.

Sue: What makes a fractional different from someone who is a consultant, from someone who is part time, from someone who is just straight outsource, is the level of engagement. This person as a fractional, they are to come into the organization, and like I said, they sit in the C suite, and so they are truly invested in the results.

Sue: That they are on point that their strategy that they're building is on point for delivering and that is really what truly differentiates a fractional from a consultant who will come in, build a strategy and then hand it over to the team. And then the team's on point for for implementing that. With a fractional, the fractional is on point for leading that implementation, is on point for the result, and is on point for the success of the [00:04:00] growth of the organization.

Mehmet: That's a great explanation, explanation, Sue, actually. Now, what do you think was the main driver to see this, you know, kind of boom in, in, in Fractional? To be honest with you, like, maybe it was there under different names. But it was at the same time that I started my podcast last year, early in Jan, actually 2023, when I start to see the word fractional starting to pick up.

Mehmet: And as you mentioned, it's not only in one field in marketing, it's in sales. So what is. You know, the main driver to see the shift to in the market and the need for the fractional model.

Sue: So Mehmet, there are many different drivers. So if you look on the company side, so if you look at where we're at. You know, small business owners, they can no longer afford to retire, [00:05:00] right?

Sue: Interest rates are up. Cost of living is up. Inflation is up. And if you also look, the amount of VC dollars is down. And in 2022 public fintechs as an example, lost more than 70 percent of their valuation. So it's leaving small businesses right now in a bind and they can't afford the high recruiting costs.

Sue: They can't afford a full-time person. So what's happening is that they need an alternative. They need fractional talent. They need someone that they can bring in at a senior, let's just say a senior finance person, a senior ops person, a senior marketing person. They can get three of those people for the price of one executive.

Sue: So if you can get a CMO, A CFO, and A COO, all for the price of a COO. It's a great opportunity to help them get get through that growth strategy. We know when we look at small businesses, they have stagnated. And so if you look at the data, the data [00:06:00] says that companies super struggle to grow between one and 10 million in revenue.

Sue: So by hiring fractional executives, like I said, people who are embedded and engaged in getting the results, they can then Help with that growth of the company. Then if you take a look on the flip side, on the fractional side, we have got a significant number. If we look at the great resignation, if you look at the number of baby boomers out there and what's super interesting, if you look at the number of baby boomers who do not have retirement savings, it's, it's, it's crazy number.

Sue: It's something like 46 percent of baby boomers have less than a hundred thousand dollars in retirement savings. So we've got people with. Senior level of expertise. They've got an inability to retire and yet they don't want to work full time. And so what we're seeing is that they're looking for fractional work.

Sue: They want to be at a senior level. They [00:07:00] want to make significant contributions. They just want to do it on a fractional level. And if you look at the data on the fractional side, at the beginning of October, if you did a search in LinkedIn, you would find that there were 50,000 fractionals. So I would say this is self-identified.

Sue: So anyone who self-identifies as a fractional executive. As of the beginning of March, that number had grown to 88,000. So, again, just looking at the sheer numbers on both sides, um, you know, if you look at the sheer number of companies, you know, there are 17 million companies who fall in that 1 to 10 million dollar range, and we've now got 88, 000 fractional.

Sue: The time is right to bring these two groups together. And really help all of those businesses and fractionals thrive,

Mehmet: you know, interesting statistics, too And I think you know, maybe these numbers are u. s. Based You know personas right [00:08:00] now, of course, you know when I ask the question I try to be on the other side It's not to challenge or anything But I think maybe I had this discussion with someone a few weeks ago when we were discussing the fractional model, and it was mainly from CTO perspective, more into technical stuff, but it can apply to anything.

Mehmet: So the question that arrived is, okay, I understand the benefit me as a startup or small business. I cannot afford the full time, but this person is going to be working Other entities and there might arise some conflict of interest now How important it's for whoever want to offer the fractional service to have kind of?

Mehmet: You know Legal protection so they don't get sued by whoever they are working with. Hey, you're working with [00:09:00] me Let's say 20 hours per week But at the same time you're working with another firm for five hours and another one for 10 hours another one for two three hours So how they can protect themselves legally, you know when when they are working with multiple clients and you know Do you usually advise people to?

Mehmet: Try to separate, you know, the type of customer that they are working with. How, how do you approach this concern too?

Sue: So, first of all, I'm not a lawyer, but what it comes down to is that working as a fractional exec, if I look at it from the company side, it's no different than hiring a consultant. And consultants have been juggling multiple clients for decades.

Sue: So when I look at it from that perspective, it really is, is no different. Um, for, you know, from hiring, you know, hiring a consultant and a consulting firm who have multiple clients across multiple, you know, across the same function. [00:10:00] If I look at it from the fractional side, I really think that there's an ethical obligation for a fractional to disclose who they're, who they're working for, and frankly, not to take on clients who would, would provide that conflict of interest.

Sue: If I'm the small business. Or, you know, start up looking to take on a client. I would absolutely ask for that disclosure and I would ask them to sign something. Again, I'm not a lawyer, but something along the lines of a non compete that says that they are not working with any competitive clients. But on the flip side to that, Mehmet, where there's a huge benefit here is that maybe they're not working for the same client in the same industry, but they're working, as you say, in the CTO space on a project that is similar but non competitive.

Sue: They're able to bring a significant number of insights And benefits and best practices. So if you're working as a full time [00:11:00] employee, you're in an organization and you're working on one set of, you know, one project or one set of projects within the organization, you have one lens that you're looking through.

Sue: A fractional executive can bring best practices because they're looking at multiple projects across multiple, across multiple companies. And that is a huge benefit for those small organizations because they're getting. A much broader view of the world than what they would've gotten if they had just hired one person.

Mehmet: That's very logical. And of course it's, I didn't ask the question to get legal advice, but you know, people like to challenge sometimes the ideas, which is, but perfectly, you put it in the right, uh, I would say approach, like if you deal with consultants or even freelancers, so it's the same. So it's the same thing because usually the.

Mehmet: Solution for that that me as a startup or small medium business. I think it's my responsibility To draft ndas and you know have these ndas in place with [00:12:00] people i'm working with the fractionals to to protect themselves so So tell me

Sue: I'd even suggest as a fractional like as a fractional myself. I'm, you know, I do fractional work And when I'm even in sales calls, because I need to have a level of information to know if I can help them.

Sue: So I will provide them. The perspective client with an NDA, even during the sales process, because I want to be able to receive the information that I need in order to make an informed decision. How do I know if I can help someone? How do I know if I can provide them value? and an added service if I don't have a deep enough understanding of their organization.

Sue: And so I often will sign an NDA and encourage the, the client, the prospective client to sign that NDA right up front, like right in that sales process so that you can get that level of depth and understanding that's really important.

Mehmet: Absolutely. Now, so you've been doing this for quite some time. Like [00:13:00] if we want to put some, You know, ranking, um, like which type of fractions are the most demanded?

Mehmet: Is it like the ones who are more related to sales and marketing? Are they, are they the, the ones related to technology? Like what are you seeing? You know, because I know you, you, you, you are very close to this domain. So I want to like a little bit also, um, you know, let the audience know what are the priorities usually comes when, when hiring these fractions.

Sue: When we look at hiring fractionals, what we typically find is that the fractional CFO comes in first. So it's usually the CFO who comes in to the organization first and then it is often, uh,

Sue: So they're saying, all right, we need to get our financial heads in order. So CFO comes in first, then [00:14:00] they're saying, all right, we need to get sales and marketing, or we need to get our operations in place. And so that often depends on the type of organization. Now, that being said, If this is because these are generally technology companies that I'm basing, so they have got the CIO or the CTO in place, right?

Sue: They've got that tech person already in place. So if that's, you know, if, for example, we're talking about tech specifically, it is the CFO. And then either CMO and then followed by the CHRO is, is often the hierarchy of how that comes in.

Mehmet: Yeah, that's logical because they need to keep the books in place first.

Mehmet: So this is where the CFO might, uh, Might be the first I mean the fractional CFO might be the first hire I would say which is logical and then you know the rest of the functions now What is the threshold after which so let's say everything is going [00:15:00] fine. Um All going good and now they are scaling. So at what stage do you advise them to Stop hiring fractionals and go back to hire

Sue: So again, that's going to be on a case by case basis, right? When we look at it, you know, it's one of these, you know, it's one of these things where it really is going to be on, you know, an on an individual basis, right? Because I've seen organizations who hire fractionals. And they're at 10 million and they're and they're running on fractional, right?

Sue: So i've seen organizations who are, you know smaller than that But running, you know, they're then starting to have You know more full time. I think it really depends on the type of business if i'm going to be honest with you You know when [00:16:00] we look at you know, like we said we look at the at the hierarchy It just really comes down to, yeah, it's really going to come down to the type of business when I, when I look at it and, and, and where their growth priorities are, because let me give you an example, if I am, you know, a startup and I'm growing and I am really looking to get, you know, another, a series a or a series B investment, then I'm probably going to want that full time CFO to be there, to be looking at the numbers.

Sue: I might want. Somebody full time in marketing and product development again to be to demonstrate that this is, you know, that we are that they're, you know, really driving towards that. So I think it just depends if we're looking at an organization, he says, you know what? We're not looking to be acquired.

Sue: We're not looking for funding. We're just looking to grow. It's going to depend on the type of company. That it that it comes down to. But at the end of the [00:17:00] day, I would suggest that if they're looking for funding or not will be a big driver of where they're putting their full time employees.

Mehmet: Absolutely.

Mehmet: It's case by case and it's good. You mentioned, you know, when they're going to go and raise funds, of course. People need to see who are, you know, especially the CFO, they care about mainly the CFO and, uh, sometimes the CRO as well, the chief revenue officer. So a hundred percent on that. Now, now walk me a little bit through in, in, in your current company, Hi Ref Rectional.

Mehmet: So how that differs from a traditional. Talent sourcing firm. Like, I mean, is the process similar? Is there like some other ways you do? And I'm sure like also because you've been doing this and you bootstrapped actually your company. So I'm sure like you've seen it all and you faced some challenges. So walk me through a little [00:18:00] bit the process.

Mehmet: So if I come to you today, is it the same thing as if I go today Um any talent firm that they have bunch of talents and they do talent hunting Like what what are the differences here? And tell me a little bit more about the challenges and the lessons, you know that You have uh down the road. Yeah,

Sue: of course so, um, no hierarchical is different it is a very different model because We recognize, as we talked about earlier on, the challenges are that these small businesses are struggling to grow.

Sue: They don't have the resources to go to a large talent organization. So if you take somebody like a Korn Ferry or, you know, a Michael Page, they are, you know, they're going to charge you a significant amount of money. So we set up Hirefractional to be a matching service. So it is more like, think like Airbnb, think Uber.

Sue: So a company will come to us. [00:19:00] They, to list their job for free. We are not charging the company at all. And then, and there's no upsells, like there's no gimmicks. It's not like, oh yeah, here's a free plan and then there's all these paid add ons. That's not the way this works. They come, they can build an account, they post their job for free.

Sue: They get full access into the database of fractionals, and then on the flip side, the fractionals see the jobs that get posted, and so the fractionals can join the database for a low monthly fee. And so that is our finance model that says, you know, the fractionals can come and be part of this. Um, and then, like I said, they pay, pay the low monthly fee, but we recognize that, that these organizations, you know, need these fractionals.

Sue: Uh, they, you know, they need them desperately to grow, but yet they couldn't afford to post their jobs anywhere. And so what we wanted to do was create a place where they could post their jobs. For free. And so this is a very different and unique model that that no one is is using out [00:20:00] there right now, which really makes up a big differentiator for us.

Mehmet: That's amazing. And, you know, I like, you know, the differentiation than the traditional model, which is, you know, Uh, I think maybe this what's leading you to the success one other thing that um while preparing to the episode I noticed you've done and i'm curious to know like how was first their reaction and how it benefited you actually I know like you had done some strategic partnerships Uh with the industry giants like Deloitte and Accenture.

Mehmet: So how did they see it from, you know, because these big fours, you know, they were, you know, any big company, they have set up models and usually, you know, they say, okay, things are working the way it's working today. Um, so how did they accept You know what? What do you propose? I mean, the partnership that you have done and how it benefited you in your company.

Sue: So what it comes down to at the end of the day, [00:21:00] all organizations, whether you're, you know, an Accenture, you know, doing what are they at these days, like 45 billion in revenue. There are immense cost pressures on every organization these days. And so they're looking for alternatives. They're looking for places where they can go to find the right talent that they need in order to grow their business.

Sue: And so, you know, whether you're a large organization like et cetera, or Deloitte, or you're a smaller organization, you know, you're on a million dollar. Bootstrap startup, you know, it doesn't matter. They, they're going to be getting access to that same level of talent. And so the fact that they can put that job in there.

Sue: It's low risk. In fact, it's no risk. There is there is no risk for a company to come and put their job in the database and see what they can find. They get full access. So not only can fractionals apply, there is the ability for our companies to do. They can search the database. They can go in. They can do a full search and [00:22:00] say, Hey, I'm looking for a CIO in the US.

Sue: That's B2B and technology focus. Like, there's a number of filters that they can put on it. And then they can do a direct outreach. To that fractional and so they can go ahead. They can go into the database. They can post their job and then if and then they can do a search. And if there's people that they are interested in speaking with, they can then do the direct outreach.

Sue: And again, that's all at no cost to them. So that is the biggest benefit to them is that they can come in and they can explore and they can find what they need. For no cost. So like I said, whether you're a large organization or a small organization, the price is the same.

Mehmet: Yeah, that's good. Good to know also.

Mehmet: So out of curiosity, have you seen any case where the fractional at any part of the business done so much good? In in in what he or she's doing and they [00:23:00] get later on called by the business owners or the founders like you know What you've done such a great job. We want you full time. Have you seen such cases sue?

Sue: Absolutely. And so I mean it's and i'll be honest. It's happened to me personally. And so When you're a fractional, you know, there are some fractionals who become fractional because they say, all right, I've been laid off from my job, or I want to exit the workplace for a while, or as a senior leader, maybe you're part of the sandwich generation, and you're saying, all right, I've got, you know, teenage kids who need me to still drive them to volleyball, soccer, piano, but I've also got aging parents, and I don't have capacity for a full time job anymore.

Sue: I want to be fractional. Then, you know, take 10 years on out of that, you know, the kids are now maybe in university. You know, the parent's situation has potentially changed, they may have more space. So, if they've been working fractionally, and then their home life [00:24:00] and their personal situation has changed, often those people, you know, if they get offered full time, they might take it.

Sue: And so, again, I think it would come down to somebody's personal situation, but generally what I see is that if somebody is fractional, what they're valuing in being fractional now. Is multiple or working in multiple organizations and having multiple jobs and why that's important to them is that they like the variety they like that.

Sue: They're doing strategy and leadership work and they like that. They're working in organizations where they're getting results, but they also very much value that cross pollination, bringing best practices and ideas from one organization into another is really important to them. And I often find that once you become fractional and you get a taste of having.

Sue: multiple clients and the ability to to really have that hive mind and those shared, they bring that shared thinking into organizations, they generally want to stay fractional. But yes, I have seen cases where it's the right, [00:25:00] it's just the right time of life for someone to become full time again.

Mehmet: Yeah, absolutely.

Mehmet: And to your point, and I think, You know, we, we talked about it at the beginning, why we see this, uh, uh, trend. And to your point, I think people actually, they like it also sometimes because they, I know someone personally was very, very senior, right. And the beauty out of it, of course, like it has also to be, you know, and again, it's not a career advice to anyone anyway, but yeah, it's, it's a trend and, you know, I, um, I'm kind of doing it in different approaches.

Mehmet: So one rewarding part is, and that, that gentleman who's doing it, telling me that, you know, I don't have to be under the pressure of, you know, one company because I'm fractional, right? So I'm kind of a consultant, but at the same time, I'm doing it into a leadership style. So it's kind more of a. [00:26:00] Coaching plus, um, giving insights, sharing the experience, managing the team, but not into the day to day activity.

Mehmet: It's like much more on a high level. Um, you know, checking out on them and to your point also, so like, do they need actually to go back? So I asked a couple of people who do this today and they tell me, no, we prefer to keep. Doing this on the long term, although they received also some offers to become full timers, which is like interesting.

Mehmet: I would say now, um,

Sue: But you make a good point about the team and a big part of what you're doing as a fractional is that you're building a team. It's not just about the day to day management, but it's about building the team because you're growing an organization, right? This is fractional executives are typically coming into growing organizations and in order for an organization to grow You [00:27:00] need to put the foundations in place.

Sue: So I look at it from a marketing strategy perspective I need to put the process in place I need to put the strategy in place and I need to put the people in place In order to grow that organization, because again, as a fractional executive, I'm there on a finite timeline. I'm not looking to be there long term.

Sue: I'm looking to build something that is sustainable, so that I can exit. And I think that's also important because it's about building that team. It's about building the strategy, but it's about building something sustainable so that at some point you can exit. And to your point, You can do the succession planning so that you're finding your replacement.

Sue: So, in some cases, it's, you know, I've gone in and I've built the team under the expectation that I also need to hire the full time CMO. So, build the team, build the strategy, bring the CMO in. Train that person so that I can exit.

Mehmet: Yeah, actually another trend [00:28:00] which I start to see so when these Fractions come again at every level.

Mehmet: I mean whether operations finance technology So what they are offered later on so they say okay, we know that you don't want the full time job But we're gonna give you an advisor role kind of So even sometimes they are giving, given equities, if they are like an early stage startups, they just say, we want you to be our advisor, right?

Mehmet: So we want to make sure you keep giving us, even if your term as a fractional finish. But we want you to be part of the team without being full time I've seen also this in some situations, which is great because again, it's it's good for the startup. It's good for the Fractional so everyone, uh win as we say um Now you touched a lot about marketing.

Mehmet: I know you're you do the fractional same one. I'm gonna ask you like Maybe a marketing question more than a [00:29:00] fractional question. So, uh, so with the experience you have. So today, um, and I'm asking this from startup perspective today. I just had a discussion with a founder and we were talking about marketing mainly.

Mehmet: Now, in marketing, there's a lot of debate about what's the future would be like, is it gonna be just, you know, as we were doing before relying on, uh, more outreach approach? Are we going to see more like, Content approach. I'm talking in the b2b space to be specific. Okay, not in the b2c Space the b2b because where I focus Honestly more when I talk to founders or are we going?

Mehmet: To see more what we are seeing today. It's about the brand awareness and personal branding So from your [00:30:00] experience in that domain, if you can give hints to, to startup founders today, where are the areas that they should be focusing on? And of course they need to search a fraction of who understand this as well.

Mehmet: So this is why I asked you this question in this way.

Sue: Yeah. So as a startup, so if I was to come into a startup, I would really look at what are their foundations. So it's, you know, it's the old analogy of building a house. So there are certain foundations you need to have in place. You need to have a CRM.

Sue: You have to have a way of capturing your customers. You have to understand the customer journey and you have to have a way of nurturing those customers. So once they're in your world, you have to have a way. So that's number one in terms of foundations. Number two, you, you touched on it, which is brand.

Sue: You need to have a good, you know, you need to build your brand awareness. You need to have a clear definition of your niche. You need to have a clear understanding of who your target customers, you [00:31:00] need to know what geographies and where they sit, and then you need to have a clear understanding of what their pain points are.

Sue: And so that is really that second foundation around brand. It's not just about creating the awareness, but it's really understanding and having a clear, a clear idea of Who they are, where they live, and what is keeping them up at night, and what are their bigger pain points. Only then, once you have those two pieces in place, then you can start saying, alright, what am I going to do on what we call inbound?

Sue: So, that is your brand awareness, that is your content generation, that is That is the founder going out and making a name for themselves. And that's everything we need to look at on the inbound side. And then we need to look at the outbound side to say, all right, so what are we going to do to actively bring people in?

Sue: And so is that cold email outreach? Is that LinkedIn outreach? What does that call? Is it partnerships? Is it associations? Is it other people's audiences? What are we doing on the outbound to bring, to bring those leads in? [00:32:00] Because. At the end of the day, it's all about lead generation and lead tracking. And if you don't have a way to put a lead tracking in place, which, as I said, first off is your CRM, you need to have a CRM in place, and it doesn't have to be expensive, right?

Sue: There are very, very affordable CRMs out there that founders can put in place. If we don't have that tracking, because the number one thing we have to do is track leads. We have to be able to track the number of leads that are coming to the organization. We have to be able to attract, you know, we have to understand how, how that turns into an MQL, how that turns into an SQL, how we translate, you know, how do we go from inquiry to opportunity.

Sue: And then once we're there, we need to put that whole set of metrics in place. We need to understand the KPIs. What are we tracking? You know, what is our close rate? What is our churn rate? What is our lifetime value? So having those metrics is absolutely critical. So you say, [00:33:00] what's important in marketing these days?

Sue: One is the foundation, making sure you've got that CRM. Two, your brand messaging, your customer journey, your niche, your audience. Um, and then, you know, then it's inbound in terms of content generation and brand awareness. It's outbound in terms of, you know, cold LinkedIn, um, cold email. And then it's all about putting that lead scoring, lead tracking in place so that we can track everything right from inquiry to close sale to churn to lifetime value.

Mehmet: Absolutely. Uh, like, sure, like if you want to put kind of final tips and, uh, suggestions for anyone who's out there maybe listening to us today. Maybe one or multiple founders listening to us today and they want to start their journey in hiring fractionals. Right. So, uh, what advice you [00:34:00] would give them?

Sue: So, the number one thing that I would recommend is do a needs assessment and really understand which fractional you need.

Sue: Everybody says, I need leads. I need to grow my business. But where are your gaps? And so you need to do that gap analysis to say if i'm going to grow my business I need a cfo or if i'm going to grow my business I need someone to help me with operations or if i'm going to grow my business I need that marketing person because I really just do need lead generation.

Sue: I have product market fit I you know, I have all of these other pieces in place. So The number one thing that I would recommend to a founder or to anyone who's considering to hire a fractional I would say do that needs assessment do that gap analysis to figure out which is the right first hire for them.

Mehmet: That's Uh great to hear the sue actually and thank you for sharing this. It's very valuable Uh as we are coming to an end tell me where people can get in touch with you and find more about [00:35:00] high reflection

Sue: Yeah, so come to the website hirefractional. com easy branding And for me just reach out to me on linkedin sumisco on linkedin And I would absolutely love to connect with you.

Mehmet: Sure. I will make sure that the link and your Uh, you know, you link it in also link it will be in the show notes And again, so thank you very much for sharing your experience and talking to us today about the fractional and everything fractional Uh as a closing note from my side, I believe we're gonna see this more and more Um, and by the way, maybe I should have asked you and you know, actually you can tell me your opinion I believe also and You might not find it directly related but AI also helped, you know us To come out and say yeah, we can be fractionals because actually, you know, we can have you know Some some some [00:36:00] help in automating things and you know that we can do more with less kind of uh, and I believe you know, the The way moving forward at least for now I'm expecting to see more and more fractionals Um funny enough, you know As I was telling you at the beginning, last year, beginning of last year, there was no single title of fractional in my region, in, in the Middle East, in Dubai and this region.

Mehmet: Today I start to see more and more people using this title mainly in the technology space. I started to see a lot of fractional CTOs. I start to see some fractional CFOs as well. And but I believe, you know, the, you know, the trend is moving up and to your point, people want more freedom. They want more, you know, experience with more sectors.

Mehmet: So thank you very much for sharing that with us. So I tried to little bit. Conclude with what we have discussed [00:37:00] today and this is for the audience. So if you just Discovered our podcast by luck. Thank you for passing by. I hope you enjoyed it if you did so, please Subscribe and share with your friends and colleagues and if you are one of the loyal followers who keep come Thank you very much for keep coming and please keep sending me your suggestions your comments and approaching me with anything That you want to discuss i'm available on linkedin mainly so you can reach out to me also as well And as I say always thank you very much for tuning in.

Mehmet: We will meet again very soon. Thank you. Bye. Bye